--- Log opened Fri Sep 04 00:00:44 2009
00:03 < millinao> ooh
00:04 <@Andy_J> 19:25:12 < Spengo> I want 4 random numbers all different all immediately after each other :<
00:04 <@Andy_J> 19:25:32 < Spengo> almost every time all the numbers are the same :'(
00:04 <@Andy_J> you're doing it wrong, if you get that.
00:04 < Spengo> yes I noticed
00:04 < Spengo> it's all fixed now
00:05 <@Andy_J> .NET doesn't have something like Math.random() in Java?
00:05 < millinao> you create a Random object, which is feeded with the time
00:06 < millinao> and then you use that object to generate
00:06 < millinao> I think spengo was creating four random objects, and all of them had the same time
00:06 <@Andy_J> yes I see that
00:06 <@Andy_J> but java has a way to just get properly random randoms without making an object
00:06 <@Andy_J> it's not nearly as flexible but you can do it
00:06 < millinao> that's great for java
00:07 <@Andy_J> my point is, why doesn't .NET have that since they so thoroughly ripped of java everywhere else ;)
00:08 <@_Auron_> java has a way of getting a random number without an object? do tell.
00:08 <@Andy_J> 20:05:15 <@Andy_J> .NET doesn't have something like Math.random() in Java?
00:09 <@_Auron_> I use Random rand = new Random();
00:09 <@Andy_J> http://java.sun.com/j2se/1.4.2/docs/api/java/lang/Math.html#random()
00:09 <@_Auron_> ah
00:10 < TD-Linux> AWKWARD MOMENT
00:10 <@_Auron_> oh, but it doesn't take in an int
00:10 < Tar1> MADE MORE AKWARD BY MISSPELLING AKWARD
00:11 <@Andy_J> Math.random() * int_you_normally_use
00:11 <@Andy_J> not that hard.
00:11 < Tar1> CRAP
00:11 <@_Auron_> Andy_J: Yeah I know :P
00:11 <@Andy_J> :P
00:11 <@_Auron_> by the way
00:11 <@_Auron_> I LOVE CALCULUS
00:11 <@_Auron_> :D
00:11 < mokomull> _Auron_: Which calculus are you taking?
00:11 <@_Auron_> Calculus I
00:12 <@Andy_J> lim (calculus -> Andy_J) you.hp = 0+
00:12 <@_Auron_> lol
00:13 < TD-Linux> girl posted on facebook: "I got new phone!"
00:13 < TD-Linux> I called and said "I'm testing your phone!"
00:13 <@_Auron_> k?
00:14 < TD-Linux> "you got a new phone?" "no you did, I'm testing it" "ohh..." "my phone is indestructible, I will never get a new one" ... ... "oh I'm at church, got to go"
00:14 < millinao> you should have said "I test your phone"
00:14 < TD-Linux> how likely is it that she was really at church?
00:15 <@Andy_J> when?
00:15 < TD-Linux> right now
00:15 <@Andy_J> unlikely
00:15 <@_Auron_> o.O
00:15 <@_Auron_> thursday night? heh
00:15 <@Andy_J> she wouldn't haev answered it ;p
00:15 < millinao> so, she lied to get out of an ackward conversation
00:15 < TD-Linux> XD
00:15 < TD-Linux> I fail :D
00:16 <@Andy_J> what else is new
00:16 < TD-Linux> I'm crashing a party tonight
00:16 < TD-Linux> actually it's a bonfire, which could make crashing it a bit dangerous
00:17 < millinao> be sure to ruin every single conversation you enter
00:17 < TD-Linux> I'm going with someone named abir, which raised a few eyebrows
00:17 < TD-Linux> "I'm crashing __ party with abir"
00:18 < millinao> "Hey, man, how's it going? How's your wife?" *talks about crap* "So what about you? How are you?" "I'm good." then say nothing else
00:20 <@_Auron_> HOLY FUCK
00:20 <@_Auron_> 1TB Samsung External drive for $84.99
00:20 < millinao> and I jizz, in my pant
00:20 < millinao> s
00:20 <@_Auron_> heh
00:20 < millinao> damnit mine was 100$ and it's only 320GB
00:22 <@Andy_J> you can probably actually do better than that if you buy the parts seperately
00:44 < BrandonW> The 89Ti app key was cracked, I think we're waiting on the 92+ app key, and the 010A (84+/SE app key) sieving is done.
00:45 < mokomull> Hell, I paid $130 for 500GB internal drives
00:46 < mokomull> I seem to be working on the v2 stuff as we speak
00:46 < BrandonW> I think we're all sieving the Voyage 200 app key right now.
00:47 < mokomull> I'm just glad to see I finally got more workunits.
00:47 < BrandonW> The two keys still up in the air are the 73 OS key, which I think we're still working on, and the date stamp key, which I don't think we've even gotten to yet (start of phase 2).
00:48 <@chronomex> awesome
00:49 < BrandonW> The data files are now password-protected, though, which means no secret mysterious phase 3-ers.
00:49 < BrandonW> I think the final processing might go a little slower.
00:49 < BrandonW> From here on out.
00:50 < mokomull> "mysterious phase 3-ers"?
00:50 <@chronomex> phase 3 == linear algebra
00:50 < BrandonW> People with the PCs power enough to do phase 3.
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00:50 <@chronomex> I think people were doing it via BOINC and nobody knew who was doing the final phase
00:50 < mokomull> I'm still not certain what the different phases are for ...
00:51 <@chronomex> 1 = finding a polynomial
00:51 < BrandonW> It's math I don't understand and can't explain.
00:51 <@chronomex> 2 = generating relations from the polynomial
00:51 < BrandonW> Someone has to do consolidate all the relations and do the final linear algebra on it.
00:51 <@chronomex> 3 = linear algebra on the relations, this reveals the factors
00:51 < BrandonW> On a single PC.
00:51 < mokomull> oh geez
00:51 < BrandonW> has to consolidate*
00:51 < mokomull> what kinds of hardware does that take?
00:51 <@chronomex> bunch of ram
00:51 < mokomull> how much?
00:51 < BrandonW> A quad core PC with 8+GB of RAM and a 64-bit OS.
00:52 < mokomull> I've got a quad with 6GB and 64-bit Linux. :(
00:52 < BrandonW> You might be able to give it a shot.
00:53 < BrandonW> I can get you the really basic and cryptic documentation we have if you want to try.
00:54 < mokomull> Well, if you need me to, I'm here.  I'm relatively uninterested in driving the process, as I'm recovering from flu and this is the tail end of my first week back to school :P
00:55 < BrandonW> The French guys are getting paranoid.
00:55 -!- Barrett_ [~Barrett@75-165-238-173.slkc.qwest.net] has joined #tcpa
00:55 < BrandonW> Wanting RSA keys for e-mailing of the factors and whatnot.
00:55 < BrandonW> They're terrified of getting a cease-and-desist notice.
00:55 <@chronomex> pfeh
00:56 <@chronomex> I haven't heard a peep
00:56 < BrandonW> We're talking a week at best here, everyone just lay low and this thing will be over with.
00:56 < BrandonW> All we need is the 92+ app key and TI is forever screwed.
00:56 < BrandonW> And it's in phase 3.
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00:57 <@chronomex> :D
00:57 < BrandonW> The key cracked today is pretty useless, I can't even find an app to validate it with.
00:58 <@chronomex> hm
00:58 <@chronomex> let me take a look
00:59 < BrandonW> The way you can tell is by looking at offset 0x57 of the 89K file.
00:59 < BrandonW> 09 is good, 03 is bad.
01:00 <@chronomex> aye
01:00 <@chronomex> can you take an 03-keyed app, edit it to have 09 + the signature, and then try installing on both an 89 and an 89Ti?
01:00 < BrandonW> Yes, I most certainly could. But I'm lazy.
01:01 <@chronomex> heh
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01:01  * chronomex &
01:01 < BrandonW> What does that mean?
01:02 < BrandonW> That you're gone?
01:02 < Merthsoft> yes
01:02 < BrandonW> I don't get it.
01:03 < Merthsoft> he's detaching his process or something
01:03 < Merthsoft> if you're in a unix shell and say "program &" program won't run in the terminal, so you can do other thing
01:05 < Merthsoft> i have a meeting tomorrow to talk about grad school with our pre-professional coordinator :|
01:11 < Merthsoft> i also have to learn how to use fork() & exec() and pthreads
01:11 < Merthsoft> and i didn't cook my ramen enough
01:14 < Merthsoft> and my internet is broken
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01:16 < Merthsoft> l
01:16 < BrandonW> a
01:18 < Merthsoft> m
01:18 < BrandonW> b
01:18 < Merthsoft> s
01:18 < mokomull> t
01:18 < Tar1> e
01:18 < mokomull> a
01:18 < BrandonW> What in the world is that?
01:18 < BrandonW> I thought we were doing lambchop.
01:18 < mokomull> you fucked it up
01:18 < mokomull> I was going for lambsteak
01:19 < Tar1> k
01:19 < Merthsoft> i was doing lambs
01:20 < BrandonW> Pervert.
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01:23 < DrDnar> I know a game that hasn't been done the TI-83+. robotfindskitten
01:25 < BrandonW> What is that?
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01:28 < DrDnar> A silly game.
01:28 < DrDnar> A very silly game.
01:28 < DrDnar> http://robotfindskitten.org/
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01:36 < BrandonW> 89Ti app key verified.
01:36 < i_c-Y> nice.
01:36 < TheStorm> woot
01:37 < BrandonW> It's piss simple to re-sign a 68k application or OS upgrade.
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01:38 < DrDnar> So now the memory protections on the 68K calcs are void; we can just resign the OS.
01:38 < BrandonW> Yes, we have all the OS keys (except for the TI-73, which is always susceptible to the battery trick).
01:39 < Merthsoft> BrandonW: did you use the os i sent you?
01:39 < BrandonW> I'll sign it now.
01:39 < BrandonW> Since I'm in the zone.
01:39 < BrandonW> I forgot, what model was it for?
01:40 < BrandonW> 89Ti.
01:40 < Merthsoft> yeah
01:40 < Merthsoft> and hopefuly your name will be on the about screen
01:43 < BrandonW> It's transferring now.
01:45 < Merthsoft> :)
01:45  * Grue` heads to the airport to catch his flight to Dragon*Con
01:45 < BrandonW> It's kind of disturbing that there's no checksum on the file or anything.
01:46 < Merthsoft> im ok wit it
01:46 < BrandonW> I could just write crap from 0 to 0x4E in theory.
01:46 < Merthsoft> did your name show up?
01:46 < BrandonW> Still transferring.
01:46 < Merthsoft> laaaame
01:46 < BrandonW> The 89Ti OS is big, and I'm using I/O.
01:47 < TheStorm> The sad part is it doesn't need to be that big
01:50 < i_c-Y> whats the relative size difference between 89ti and 89's os sizes?
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01:53 < efneTI92> [Randomist] CAUTION:  Exposure to this user may cause neurological damage.
01:54 < Randomist> Some dick cut the communication lines.  Internet and phone service was out almost all day around here.
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02:01 < efneTI92> [DSP_Lord] I'm not a ninja, no idea what you're talking about.
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02:07 < Randomist> I might have a desktop, if I can convince my roommate to give me his old Windows ME tower.
02:10 < Randomist> It would need some upgrades.  But it'd probably be cheaper than buying a new computer.
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02:16 < BrandonW> Merthsoft: yes, it worked.
02:16 < BrandonW> "BrandonW" in the About screen.
02:16 < Merthsoft> yayayayayayayayayyayaya
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02:18 < BrandonW> i_c-Y, I'm not sure.
02:19 < BrandonW> There might not even be one.
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02:19 < i_c-Y> but for the usb support id expect some size increase.
02:19 < BrandonW> The 89U files are 1.17 and 1.33MB, respectively.
02:21 < TheStorm> BrandonW, IIRC the older 89U ones should be even smaller
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02:29 <+JoeYoung> sup
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02:31 < bsparks> dude
02:31 < bsparks> dude
02:31 < bsparks> DUDE
02:31 < bsparks> I have a 360
02:32 < BrandonW> I'm sorry.
02:32 <+Netham45> I have my PC with 4GB in it currently(2x2GB), given that I would use all 6GB, would putting 2 more 1 GB sticks in it be more beneficial due to storage, or more harmful due to some other factor?
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02:35 < TheStorm> Netham45, are the two 1GB sticks the samy Brand?
02:35 < TheStorm> same*
02:35 <+Netham45> yes.
02:35 < i_c-Y> asymmetric dual channel is almost the same in performance as symmetric, TheStorm 
02:35 < i_c-Y> Netham45: is it overclocked?
02:35 < Merthsoft> you guys ever use pthreds?
02:36 <+Netham45> i_c-Y, no.
02:36 < BrandonW> http://brandonw.net/keys.zip has been updated with .key files for everything we have currently. http://brandonw.net/keys.txt contains the current progress (as I understand it). 5 keys remain, all out of phase 1.
02:36 < BrandonW> 0101 is the only important remaining key, believed to be in phase 3.
02:36 < TheStorm> Well Some mobo's don't support asymetric, at least it doesn't appear to
02:36 < i_c-Y> TheStorm: we arent in 2001 anymore.
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02:36 <+Netham45> I believe mine does, heh. nForce 650i.
02:36 < i_c-Y> id expect you should gain from it then, Netham45 . but just do some benchmarks before and after to try it.
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02:38 < TheStorm> i_c-Y, I have a brand new Mobo I bought last summer
02:38 < TheStorm> and it coughs up a hairball if all four sticks don't match
02:38 <+Netham45> TheStorm, wern't you one of the people bitching at Randomist because he was complaining about an old suck computer?
02:39 < TheStorm> Yes, I was talking about my old laptop.
02:40 < TheStorm> Which I used often because my parrents are devorced and I can't easily take my desktop between houses
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02:57 < incubus> where is BrandonW
02:57 < BrandonW> Here.
02:57 < incubus> Did they finish phase 2 for TI89t Apps?
02:58 < incubus> or nm that's old
02:58 < BrandonW> Yes, and 3.
02:58 < incubus> I mean 73 something
02:58 < incubus> It was either apps or OS
02:58 < BrandonW> I don't know about phase 2 on the 73 OS key.
02:58 < BrandonW> http://brandonw.net/keys.txt I just updated it.
02:58 < incubus> danke
02:59 < BrandonW> Phase 3 is either close or already here for 010A (84+/SE app key).
02:59 < incubus> :D
02:59 < incubus> have any new DMCA notices been passed around?
02:59 < BrandonW> I'm fairly certain we're in phase 3 for the 0101 key (92+ apps key, the last most important).
02:59 < BrandonW> Nope.
03:00 < BrandonW> I'll feel a lot better once we have 0101.
03:00 < BrandonW> That's when we can start gloating all over the internet.
03:00 < BrandonW> Trying to piss off TI.
03:00 < incubus> How fair/helpful has TI honestly been throughout the past decade?
03:00 < incubus> honestly, no bias
03:00 < incubus> They've done SOME things for developers
03:00 < BrandonW> I can't give it an overall rating. They've done a lot of good things, and a lot of bad things.
03:01 < incubus> so why poke the ogre?
03:01 < BrandonW> They gave us 0104, which was pretty much shooting themselves in the foot as far as paid apps and it sparked a ton of new development.
03:01 < incubus> I mean, don't get me wrong, this is just the type of person I am, I am all for pokeage
03:02 < BrandonW> Some people have been very helpful.
03:02 < BrandonW> And some have been complete assholes.
03:02 < BrandonW> Screwing them takes priority.
03:02 < BrandonW> That's about the jist of it.
03:03 < incubus> haha
03:03 < BrandonW> http://brandonw.net/keys.zip has been updated with all the latest keys, as well as .key files for easy development usage.
03:03  * incubus mirrors it
03:03 < BrandonW> I'm tinkering with some code to write a 68k app/OS signer.
03:03 < incubus> mmmm
03:04 < incubus> THAT I want
03:04 < incubus> I want an open source 89 OS
03:04 < BrandonW> It's piss easy to modify 68k OSes, just open it in a hex editor, change it, run it through the signer, transfer to calculator.
03:04 < incubus> lol
03:04 < BrandonW> No Intel Hex to worry about.
03:05 < BrandonW> Merthsoft put "BrandonW" in the 89Ti About screen, I signed it, and it's now on my 89Ti.
03:05 < Tar1> which also makes it easier to break
03:05 < Merthsoft> i'm pretty cool
03:06 < BrandonW> http://img299.imageshack.us/img299/1479/aboutl.jpg
03:06 < incubus> lol
03:07 < incubus> have TI representatives ever talked to the calculator community
03:07 < incubus> ?
03:07 < BrandonW> Yes.
03:07 < BrandonW> Several of us have/had connections.
03:07 < BrandonW> And of course they coordinated with ticalc.org for the ticalc.org CD.
03:10 < BrandonW> I predict 010A (84+/SE Flash application key), 0101 (92+ Flash application key), and 02 (73 OS key) will be released soon.
03:10 < millinao> i'm still working on the 84fa boincs
03:11 < BrandonW> We're still sieving 0108 (Voyage 200 Flash application key) and possibly the date stamp key.
03:11 < BrandonW> They think they might have enough relations for 010A.
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03:11 < BrandonW> (010A = 84fa)
03:11 < incubus> what's the average time Phase 2 has come down to?  From 78 days on one computer to x=? days on multiple computers? :)
03:12 < BrandonW> Last I heard we're processing 20,000 work units per day.
03:12 < BrandonW> And a key can be done in 1-2 days.
03:12 < BrandonW> It's 2-3 more days for phase 3.
03:13 < Merthsoft> BrandonW: that's the coolest pic i've seen ina while
03:13 < DrDnar> With that kind of power we could start processing personal keys. Maybe even find they're generated with an algorithm.
03:13 < BrandonW> You made it, not me.
03:13 < Merthsoft> yeah, but you got the pic
03:14 < BrandonW> I very much doubt we'll figure out how/if they're generated.
03:14 < incubus> :(
03:14 < incubus> what are personal keys used for?
03:14 < incubus> Those "key overrides" ? :)
03:14 < BrandonW> Installing paid app licenses / certificate updates.
03:14 < BrandonW> Yes.
03:15 < BrandonW> We each have a unique "calculator public key", which is your personal public key.
03:15 < BrandonW> TI has the factors for all of them, somehow.
03:15 < incubus> you're able to read it yes?  I don't remember if the cert. was on the boot page/s or not
03:15 < incubus> er nm duh you're able to read boot pages
03:16 < BrandonW> They can create an 8XQ file (so can we) and sign it with those factors (we can't).
03:16 < incubus> and obviously you're able to write it, so it can't be on a boot page
03:16 < BrandonW> The certificate is in a special read-protected area of Flash. You have to unlock Flash to even read it.
03:16 < incubus> right
03:16 < incubus> which requires executing code from a priveleged address
03:17 < BrandonW> Yes.
03:17 < incubus> privleged*
03:17 < incubus> ya has to be a database like you said
03:17 < incubus> There's no way you're going to find a generating algorithm
03:18 < BrandonW> They either have a database or they have a way of going from calc ID to two large factors.
03:18 < incubus> I mean I guess there could be based on a few calculator attributes in the cert, but come on, doubtful
03:18 < incubus> BrandonW, you would be a calc god if you figured out the function to convert calc ID to factors
03:18 < BrandonW> I tried inputting crap into the web site for a calc ID and it wouldn't take it. There's either a way to validate it or it's not in their database.
03:18 < incubus> probably get a face to face personal _visit_ from TI
03:19 < incubus> :O
03:19 < incubus> interesting....
03:19 < BrandonW> I'm trying to remember if you had to give them the last 4 digits of the calc ID too.
03:19 < BrandonW> If so, they might be able to determine the public key off that.
03:20 < incubus> is it the same scenario as other other keys, personal public key encrypts a checksum?
03:21  * _Digital kicks btrfs
03:21 -!- TheStorm [~TheStorm@4.247.226.166.in-addr.arpa] has quit [Ping timeout: 369 seconds]
03:21 < BrandonW> It's actually that TI has the private key exponent (private because they're the only ones that have it) and we have the public key exponent (always 17 across all models).
03:21 < BrandonW> So only they can encrypt, everyone can decrypt.
03:21 < BrandonW> But yes, it's the exact same process.
03:21 < incubus> er sorry I understood that just came out wrong
03:22 < incubus> I mean the factors TI has would be used to encrypt the checksum
03:22 < BrandonW> MD5 hash, not checksum.
03:22 < incubus> er yah hash, sorry
03:23 < BrandonW> You DO give them the last 4 digits.
03:23 < BrandonW> On the web site.
03:23 < incubus> :O
03:23 < BrandonW> I'm not sure anyone has actually said this out loud, but the last 4 digits of the calc ID is the signature of the MD5 hash of the first 5 bytes.
03:24 < BrandonW> The public key used for that is the calculator public key.
03:24 < BrandonW> So let's think about this...
03:24  * BrandonW pulls up the disassembly.
03:24 < incubus> BrandonW, did you just realize your first statement?
03:25 < incubus> (for the first time)
03:25 < BrandonW> I've known it for a long time.
03:25 < incubus> ah
03:25 < BrandonW> I think BCALL 804Eh recalculates the last 4 digits.
03:25 < BrandonW> One of them, I forget.
03:27 < BrandonW> Ben's looked at this a lot, so if he hasn't published details of this, I really doubt I'm going to get anywhere with this.
03:27 < BrandonW> But I'm going to study this a little bit.
03:27 < BrandonW> Tonight.
03:28 < incubus> So the calculator decrypts using _2_ keys when checking for app validation?
03:28 < BrandonW> I'm not sure what you mean.
03:28 < incubus> I don't understand what an app license is
03:28 < incubus> I thought the app's md5 signature is encrypted using the keys we have already cracked
03:28 < BrandonW> A license is the public key for the key ID for that application.
03:28 < BrandonW> 0104 is a "license", so to speak.
03:28 < BrandonW> A freeware one.
03:29 < incubus> ok so it checks for a freeware license
03:29 < incubus> AND this special license?
03:29 < BrandonW> So when you install a "license" to use a paid application on your calculator (TI terminology), you're just putting the public key for it in the certificate. So that when it goes to validate it, it knows to go pull that public key.
03:29 < BrandonW> It depends on the key ID you used to sign it.
03:29 < BrandonW> If you used the freeware ID (0104), it loads the freeware "license" (public key).
03:30 < BrandonW> If you used some other key ID (the paid apps have funky stuff like 79FAh), you have to get the public key for that.
03:30 < incubus> that's what I'm wondering, how many other key IDs can it check for, a bunch?
03:30 < incubus> freeware ID, 20 other key IDs?
03:31 < BrandonW> It can check for anything you want. The app or OS specifies the key ID IN the app/OS header. That's how it knows which public key to use.
03:31 < incubus> OH
03:31 < incubus> well shoot
03:31 < BrandonW> If you notice, every 83+ Flash application we've EVER written has "DB 01h,04h" in the app header.
03:31 < BrandonW> Because we're specifying the freeware key.
03:31 < BrandonW> Which we have the factors for.
03:31 < incubus> :D
03:31 < BrandonW> Now we can specify any of these keys.
03:32 < DrDnar> We could sign applications with the OS key?
03:32 < BrandonW> Yes.
03:32 < incubus> lol
03:32 < BrandonW> It makes no sense, but you absolutely could.
03:32 < DrDnar> There's already a way to TI-84-specific apps.
03:32 <@Andy_J> we should do so now just for the hell of it.
03:32 < BrandonW> BUT the certificate has to include that key AS an app key, not an OS key.
03:32 <@Andy_J> oh
03:32 < DrDnar> Oh.
03:32 <@Andy_J> fail
03:33 < incubus> BrandonW, so change the damn certificate!!!!
03:33 < BrandonW> It's TI's convention that you use two digits for OS keys, four for app keys.
03:33 < BrandonW> But it can be whatever the hell you want.
03:33 < BrandonW> incubus, I DID!!! That was the purpose of Free83P.
03:33 <@Andy_J> DEADBEEFh?
03:33 < BrandonW> It added our own key to the certificate so you could sign using 05's factors.
03:33 < incubus> Dear god, everything makes so much sense now
03:33 < DrDnar> We can make our key IDs as long as we want?
03:33 < BrandonW> Yes.
03:33 < incubus> no
03:33 < incubus> yes?1
03:33 < incubus> madness
03:34 < BrandonW> Well, within reason, I mean don't make it longer than the size of the entire certificate...
03:34 < incubus> lol
03:34 < BrandonW> But all the OS code I've ever seen supports any key length.
03:34 < DrDnar> You'd waste half your app space anyway.
03:34 < incubus> that's crazy stupid
03:34 <@Andy_J> cool.
03:34 < incubus> CRAZY stupid
03:34 < incubus> well actually maybe not
03:34 <@Andy_J> kind of makes sense
03:34 <@Andy_J> you don't want to be limited to 2^16 keys
03:34 < incubus> BrandonW, What if they update our certificates to use crazy 2048-bit RSA keys?!
03:35 < BrandonW> TI does assume in several places that an app/OS header won't exceed 128 bytes, so practically we're talking smaller than that.
03:35 <@Andy_J> They can't do that without you knowingly installing it
03:35 < BrandonW> incubus, they can't...whatever they give us, we can just re-sign it using known keys.
03:35 < BrandonW> They are DONE.
03:35 < BrandonW> Screwed
03:35 < i_c-Y> do you really think they're going to release any updates to the TI OS's for existing calculators?
03:35 <@Andy_J> yeah, the boot code is hard-coded to 512-bit keys
03:35 < incubus> W00T!
03:35 < incubus> lmfao 
03:35 <@Andy_J> and they *can't* fix that.
03:36 < incubus> They really are screwed, it's all so clear now
03:36 < incubus> good call, good call
03:36 <@Andy_J> well, they could, but it'd only be on new calcs
03:36 < incubus> Andy_J, but BrandonW that would create a nightmare
03:36 < i_c-Y> Lets see... TI 83+, last update 2006, TI 84+ , 2007, 89 , 2003, 89 TI, 2005
03:36 < incubus> said*
03:37 < incubus> lol
03:37 < i_c-Y> 92+, 2003, voyage 200, 2005
03:37 < incubus> wait wait wait
03:37 < BrandonW> It WOULD create a nightmare, which is why they won't do it. That was part of his point.
03:37 < i_c-Y> why would they release updates anymore?
03:37 < BrandonW> To fix bugs, i_c-Y. Shut up and quit trying to suck the fun out of this.
03:37 < BrandonW> Or add teacher-requested features.
03:37 < BrandonW> Such as the Singapore thing.
03:37 < BrandonW> Or Press-to-Test updates.
03:37 < BrandonW> To screw over our exploits of it.
03:38 < BrandonW> I could go on.
03:38 < mokomull> Singapore thing?
03:38 < BrandonW> Yeah, there's a key combination you can hold when turning it on to reset all memory.
03:38 < BrandonW> One key combination displays "for Singapore"
03:38 < incubus> BrandonW, still unclear on one point, what if they remove the keys we cracked from the cert and just replaced them.  It may be crazy, but is what I'm saying impossible, because you said 'we can just re-sign it"
03:38 < BrandonW> After the reset prompt.
03:38 < BrandonW> No one has any idea why.
03:39 < BrandonW> I think it's 8+5 on the 84+/SE, OS 2.41 or 2.43+.
03:39 < BrandonW> Or 8+2, I forget.
03:39 <@Andy_J> they'd have to hide it in an OS update
03:39 <@Andy_J> and we'd notice that and remove it and re-sign with the old keys
03:39 < BrandonW> incubus, they can't remove the keys from the boot code, and we can always re-sign with those keys.
03:39 <@Andy_J> or we wouldn't notice and would jsut re-factor the new key
03:39 <@Andy_J> oh, 04 is actually in the boot code?
03:39 < BrandonW> Yes, 04 and 0A.
03:39 < BrandonW> As well as 0104 and 010A.
03:39 < incubus> ah!
03:40 -!- DSP_Lord [~darksidep@h105.238.55.139.dynamic.ip.windstream.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 360 seconds]
03:40 < incubus> I see
03:40 < incubus> yes yes that's right
03:40 <@Andy_J> I did not realize that.
03:40 <@Andy_J> So yeah, they're boned.
03:40 < BrandonW> That's why those keys were so crucial.
03:40 < BrandonW> You can "override" them in the certificate, but they'll always be in the boot code.
03:40 < BrandonW> If you override them with crap, then you can no longer receive anything signed with those keys.
03:40 < BrandonW> Hence, brick.
03:40 < BrandonW> That's why all this is so scary.
03:41 < incubus> lol
03:41 < BrandonW> That's precisely what destroy.zip does.
03:41 <@Andy_J> So they can make an OS update that will brick the calcs! Heh.
03:41 < incubus> oh wow I totally see what you mean
03:41 < incubus> you were bricking shit left and right, no wonder
03:41 < BrandonW> lol
03:41 < incubus> you were brave to do that BrandonW
03:42 < BrandonW> What's even worse than overriding the keys is putting total crap in the certificate...if the boot code can't parse it, then you can't receive an OS period.
03:42 < BrandonW> Then you're really fucked.
03:42 < BrandonW> Which I did.
03:42 < BrandonW> That was the brick I spent weeks trying to fix.
03:42 < incubus> haha
03:42 < incubus> I remember you talking about that for weeks
03:42 < BrandonW> I had to write a buffer overflow exploit just to undo it.
03:42 < BrandonW> It's a miracle it even works.
03:42 < BrandonW> And I THINK I can break that.
03:42 < BrandonW> Which means a permanent brick.
03:42 < BrandonW> I will not be trying it.
03:43 < BrandonW> And all this is because we unlocked Flash...you can see why TI wanted to stop it.
03:43 -!- DSP_Lord [~darksidep@h156.238.55.139.dynamic.ip.windstream.net] has joined #tcpa
03:43 < BrandonW> Screwing with the certificate is our worst nightmare, which is why we spent 10 years not touching it.
03:44 < BrandonW> Even the people that could unlock Flash.
03:44 <@Andy_J> where's the string on the about screen stored?
03:44 < BrandonW> You can go to ticalc.org right now, re-assemble Free83P with two lines different, and brick anyone's calculator.
03:44 < BrandonW> On the 89Ti? It's hard-coded in there somewhere.
03:44 <@Andy_J> 83+
03:44 < BrandonW> Which string?
03:45 < incubus> BrandonW, to be clear, there is an 'overriding' key ID in my cert. right now, yes?  which isn't the freeware key, and that is unique to my calc?  Possibly calculated using the Calc ID?
03:45 <@Andy_J> the bottom one
03:45 <@Andy_J> is it just in the OS?
03:45 < BrandonW> I don't know what the bottom one is, I don't have one in front of me. The help text?
03:45 <@Andy_J> I think so
03:45 < BrandonW> God damn it, every 83+ series calculator I have either has no batteries or has OS2 on it...
03:46 < BrandonW> 30 calculators and you'd think I'd have one working fine.
03:46 < incubus> BrandonW, does a TI-83+ come with 0 app licenses?
03:46 <@Andy_J> I'm in the not batteries crowd
03:47 < BrandonW> incubus, a stock certificate has no key overrides in it
03:47 < BrandonW> What it DOES have is a public key unique to your calculator. No key ID attached to it.
03:47 <@Andy_J> I haven't seen my original 83+ in years :(
03:47 < incubus> BrandonW, right, I'm with you
03:47 < incubus> BrandonW, can you name a program that will ADD a key override?
03:47 < incubus> or an app
03:47 < BrandonW> Free83P adds one.
03:47 < incubus> I don't even know what to call it
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03:47 < BrandonW> Andy_J, the help text is hard-coded in the OS.
03:47 <@Andy_J> ok
03:48 < BrandonW> You can place more text on the About screen which comes from the certificate.
03:48 < BrandonW> That's what Free83P does.
03:48 < incubus> hehe
03:49 < incubus> I can't believe you wrote that, and that it took so long for someone to do
03:49 < incubus> kudos
03:49 < incubus> and still not worthless, a valuable learning tool
03:49 < BrandonW> It's really small and straightforward, it's just knowing what to put in it, because the certificate is a scary thing.
03:49 < BrandonW> The help text IS on the bottom.
03:50 < BrandonW> There's still stuff I don't have a clue about...
03:50 < incubus> can you change your calc ID?
03:50 < BrandonW> Even Free83P's doing it wrong.
03:50 < BrandonW> There should be a signature after the certification block.
03:50 < BrandonW> Which it doesn't do.
03:50 < BrandonW> Yes, you can change your calc ID.
03:50 < BrandonW> You can "clone" calculators.
03:50 < incubus> :D
03:50 < incubus> lol!
03:50 < BrandonW> Another reason why TI doesn't want that.
03:50 < BrandonW> Because one person could buy the app yet two or more can run it.
03:50 < BrandonW> You could do that to get around Zoom Math, too.
03:51 < BrandonW> Its serial is based on your calc ID.
03:51 < incubus> nice
03:51 < BrandonW> That's what the Zoom Math crack does, it patches where it gets the calc ID to always hard-code the same calc ID.
03:51 < BrandonW> No matter what calculator you run it on.
03:51 < incubus> lol
03:51 < incubus> good call
03:52 < BrandonW> TI used to give out "developer" keys to people so that while they develop their application, they can put it on their 83+, but ONLY theirs.
03:53 < Randomist> Propritary calculator applications are lulz, anyway.
03:53 < BrandonW> Because the 8XQ file which installed the developer key was signed with that 83+'s unique key.
03:53 < BrandonW> Michael had one, as did many others.
03:53 < BrandonW> I have it.
03:53 < incubus> nice
03:53 < BrandonW> The developer key IDs were funky like 2385h.
03:53 < BrandonW> So they kept track of who had what key.
03:53 < BrandonW> And didn't duplicate them.
03:54 < BrandonW> So if they needed to expand it to 3 bytes, they could do that.
03:54 -!- JoeYoung [~Joe@c-98-200-24-14.hsd1.tx.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
03:56 < BrandonW> "ld bc,0410h \ ld a,c \ or 2 \ ld c,a" You have to wonder sometimes...
03:57 < BrandonW> I'm sure that's the result of using equates or macros, but still.
03:58 -!- Genolo [~birds@69.177.4.6] has quit [Quit: (19:34:49)» <Kironide> DOCTOR HERR BINOMIAL, I'VE FOILED YOUR EVIL FACTORS]
03:58 < BrandonW> Okay, so the first 5 bytes of the calc ID are MD5 hashed and raised to the 17th power modulo the calculator public key.
03:58 < BrandonW> The first two bytes of that signature are the last 4 digits of the calc ID.
03:59 < BrandonW> "first two bytes" meaning the two least significant.
03:59 < BrandonW> So...I don't know how/if that helps them determine the public key...
04:00 < incubus> :/
04:01 < BrandonW> This is why I think we should have a web site where people can upload certificate dumps.
04:01 < BrandonW> To study this kind of thing.
04:02 < BrandonW> Maybe there actually is a pattern.
04:02 < incubus> do we have a program to dump certs?
04:02 < BrandonW> Yes.
04:03 < incubus> nice
04:03 < BrandonW> I think it actually comes with Free83P.
04:03 < BrandonW> It would be called GETCERT.
04:03 < incubus> getcert
04:03 < incubus> aye
04:03 < Randomist> Same minds, etc.
04:04 < incubus> Randomist, ?
04:04 < incubus> that was random, but your name would be apropos to that
04:04 < DrDnar> I wrote one myself, but never uploaded it since BrandonW did his.
04:04 < DrDnar> BrandonW, does Free83P come with a certificate restorer?
04:04 < incubus> I wish my TI-83+ didn't die in a fire
04:04 < incubus> haha
04:05 < incubus> DrDnar, you didn't read the earlier story? :)
04:05 < BrandonW> DrDnar, yes. The readme states you should back up your certificate before using Free83P, which everyone should do.
04:05 < Randomist> Wha'd you do; drop it in the fire?
04:05 < incubus> oh does it, I thought you asked "why does it
04:05 < BrandonW> The certificate contains data you can never ever get back, you should always preserve it.
04:05 < DrDnar> Does it checksum the certificate or anything?
04:05 < incubus> Randomist, I left it in my car one day
04:05 < incubus> :P
04:05 < Randomist> Oooooh.
04:05 < BrandonW> No, it's a straight dump.
04:05 < incubus> (A car in texas)
04:05 < Randomist> Ouch.
04:05 < BrandonW> I used to tinker with the idea of hashing it and stuff.
04:05 < DrDnar> Just like mine.
04:06 < incubus> Someone needs to sell me a cheap TI-83+ SE
04:06 < Randomist> Yeah, that Texas sunlight is the Burninator.
04:06 < incubus> heh
04:06 < DrDnar> Actually, I have a spare TI-83+SE certificate.
04:06 < incubus> lol spare?
04:06 < DrDnar> I should start collecting certificates.
04:06 < BrandonW> Every time I got a Wal-Mart calculator, I would dump the certificate.
04:06 < BrandonW> DrDnar, yes.
04:06 < DrDnar> "Hey, can I borrow your calc for a moment?"
04:06 < Randomist> Can you do dumb things, like swapping TI-83+ with -SE certificates?
04:07 < DrDnar> I don't think the calc cares.
04:07 < BrandonW> There's nothing different between an 83+ and 83+SE certificate.
04:07 < BrandonW> But yes.
04:07 < incubus> damn are SE's rare?  I can't even find one on ebay
04:07 < Randomist> No.
04:07 < BrandonW> An 84+/SE certificate has more used areas than the 83+/SE, but the 83+/SE OS doesn't care.
04:07 < BrandonW> So you won't really hurt anything.
04:07 < DrDnar> Though I think there's something wrong with my 83+SE dump because I couldn't get it to work or something.
04:07 < Randomist> I had one with a ViewPort.
04:08 < Randomist> And I had a friend a while back that had one.
04:08 < incubus> "Garuenteed to work!" - Never buy something that lists this as a selling point.
04:08 < Randomist> Then it died.
04:08 < BrandonW> An 83+/SE calc ID starts with 04, an 84+/SE calc ID starts with 0A. So that's a way of checking whether you've done something stupid or not.
04:08 < DrDnar> My program always worked on my calc though. Might be a transmission error?
04:08 < incubus> I have a feeling BrandonW works for TI, and this is all a ploy to get us to give up our personal info
04:08 < BrandonW> The link protocol does checksums.
04:09 < Randomist> incubus:  Especially if it is spelled, "G-A-R-U-E-N-T-E-E-D."
04:09 < incubus> :)
04:09 < DrDnar> Those aren't perfect.
04:09 < incubus> that was the point.  What's the term BrandonW uses?
04:09 < incubus> _____ clod?
04:09 < BrandonW> Insensitive clod.
04:09 < incubus> haha
04:09  * Randomist throws a "was" in there, somewhere.  :)
04:10 < DrDnar> 04 1a 03 c0 bd ?
04:10 < incubus> Randomist, :D
04:10 < BrandonW> That would be an 83+/SE calc ID.
04:10 < DrDnar> Well, then, it must be good.
04:10 < DrDnar> Ya want it?
04:10 < BrandonW> yES.
04:10 < DrDnar> email?
04:10 < BrandonW> I want any certificate you can get your hands on.
04:10 < BrandonW> brandonlw@gmail.com
04:11 <@E-J> what's that l?
04:11 < Randomist> Can't you image the Flash?
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04:11 < BrandonW> Field 0A10h is the calc ID, field 0410h is the validation number (last 4 digits of calc ID), and field 0A20h is your unique calculator public key.
04:11 < Randomist> That could be useful, maybe...if there was a way to restore the image back.
04:12 < Randomist> It could grab the certs, too.
04:13 < BrandonW> Image the Flash? What are you talking about?
04:13 < DrDnar> BrandonW, does your program dump to a prgm or appvar?
04:13 < BrandonW> An AppVar.
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04:13 < incubus> BrandonW, can a ROM dump be hex edited to find the cert?  Is a .rom a direct memory dump?
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04:14 < Randomist> Yeah, that is sort of more close to what I meant.
04:14 < Randomist> * to ask
04:14 < BrandonW> A .rom file contains all of the Flash, including the certificate. Because ROM dumpers don't unlock Flash, the area where the certificate would be is typically junk.
04:14 < incubus> son of a BITCH
04:14 < incubus> oh well
04:14 < DrDnar> Wow. Just like mine.
04:14 < DrDnar> Except MY ROM dumper.
04:14 < DrDnar> MY ROM dumper unlocks flash.
04:15 < Randomist> Tennis is lulzy.
04:16 < incubus> I'm going to check if a rom dump I may or may not have unlocked flash
04:16 < Randomist> Awesome.  Maybe you can convince TiLP devs to put it in.
04:16 < BrandonW> The TiLP ROM dumper actually has code in it to unlock Flash.
04:16 < Randomist> Huh.
04:16 < BrandonW> It relies on a hacked-up OS that contains unlock code.
04:16 < BrandonW> It can't actually work for most people.
04:16 < BrandonW> It would for whoever wrote that code.
04:17 < Randomist> Aw.
04:17 < BrandonW> It's not a huge deal, just use GETCERT and overlay the AppVar's data onto the next-to-last page of the ROM dump.
04:17 < DrDnar> My ROM dumper dumps the ROM directly to a .rom file on the flash drive using USB8X.
04:17 < BrandonW> I remember that thing.
04:17 -!- incubus is now known as HFoster
04:18 < HFoster> Stop talking about this.
04:18 -!- HFoster is now known as incubus
04:18 < BrandonW> Die in a fire, Herbert.
04:18 < incubus> lol
04:18 < incubus> He truly defines Insensitive Clod.
04:18 < Randomist> "This is classified information, sir."
04:18 < incubus> haha
04:19 < DrDnar> There ya go, one more certificate for your collection.
04:19 < incubus> send it to me! :D
04:19 < Randomist> You should print them out and frame them.
04:19 < BrandonW> I have the DMCA notice in a frame right next to me.
04:19 < DrDnar> "Certificate of Certification"
04:19 < BrandonW> With the 04 and 0A factors printed right underneath his signature.
04:20 < incubus> lol
04:20 < Randomist> DrDnar:  lol
04:20 < incubus> BrandonW, we should make a #Tcpa T-Shirt with all the factors cracked
04:20 < incubus> !!
04:20 < BrandonW> It's in the works.
04:20 < incubus> YES!
04:20 < Randomist> Someone's working on tha.
04:20 < BrandonW> I will wear that shirt to work.
04:20 < incubus> I am buying it.  Maybe four
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04:21 < Randomist> I want the artwork to put on my dorm-room door.
04:21 < incubus> haha
04:21 < incubus> Let's send a shirt to Herbert
04:21 < incubus> He'd enjoy it
04:21 < Randomist> DO IT!
04:21 < incubus> I'll pay for it.
04:21 < incubus> and the shipping
04:22 < Randomist> Send one to the president, too.
04:22 < Randomist> "The keys in the White House."
04:23 < incubus> haha
04:23 -!- \\BAF\IRC [ferrisr@cpe-74-67-39-33.nycap.res.rr.com] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out]
04:23 < incubus> If someone actually makes the shirt I'll take a pic of me wearing one
04:24 < incubus> Randomist, did you contribute to the RSA lattice project?
04:24 < Randomist> Did the artwork ever get sorted out?
04:24 < Randomist> incubus:  Not until I get that desktop.  :P
04:24 < incubus> Randomist, sad
04:24 < incubus> you fail.
04:24 < incubus> Actual failures: bsparks, Shuan
04:24 < incubus> Shaun*
04:25 < Randomist> incubus:  Actually, my campus Internet fails.
04:25 < incubus> They signed up but didn't send a single work unit
04:25 < bsparks> incubus, I can't send any work units
04:25 < bsparks> PPC
04:25 < incubus> bsparks, O_o
04:25 < incubus> fail
04:25 < bsparks> Hardly
04:25 < Randomist> We had no Internet or communications for most of the day because bitches cain't drive.
04:25 < incubus> boinc fail I guess on that one
04:25 < incubus> Randomist, lol
04:25 < incubus> millinao sent in 88 work units
04:26  * incubus giggles
04:26 < bsparks> Shaun still fails, because he can't get me into the Tally Hall concert
04:26 < Randomist> Does it work over FTY or something?
04:26 < Randomist> If not that, then FTP?  :P
04:26 < incubus> FTY = Failure to Yield?
04:27 < Randomist> Haha.
04:27 < incubus> File Transfer Yearly?
04:28 < Randomist> File Transfered Yesterday.
04:28 < Randomist> Awesome technology.
04:29 < BrandonW> This code is insane.
04:29 < BrandonW> I'm really not sure what BCALL 804Eh does.
04:30 < incubus> :
04:30 < incubus> :(
04:30 < incubus> that's the next assignment, FINISH BCALLS
04:30 < Randomist> It executes instructions at memory location $804E?  :P
04:30 < incubus> We demmand it!!
04:30 < incubus> demand*
04:30 < BrandonW> That's actually...completely wrong, Randomist.
04:30 < incubus> ya he's right :(
04:31 < Randomist> O.o
04:32 < Randomist> Guess my assembly is getting Titanically rusted.
04:32 < BrandonW> Someone's asking me about the Zoom Math 200 crack.
04:32 < BrandonW> It always makes me nervous when people do that.
04:32 < BrandonW> I keep thinking it's I.Q. Joe in disguise.
04:32 < BrandonW> Trying to bust me.
04:32 < incubus> be careful
04:33 < incubus> BrandonW, do you trust me ? :)
04:33 < BrandonW> To not get me in trouble, yes.
04:35 < DrDnar> I think Zoom 200 doesn't even solve simple logs.
04:35 < BrandonW> This is the wackiest code ever, it uses the calculator public key to decrypt a couple of fields received over the link and then...uses that as the new calculator public key? o_O
04:36 < incubus> ...
04:36 < incubus> O_O
04:36 < DrDnar> How many keys DO you have BrandonW?
04:36 < incubus> well I g2g to bed, it's been fun, night.
04:36 < DrDnar> Er,
04:36 < DrDnar> Certificates.
04:37 < BrandonW> Not that many, maybe 8 at best.
04:37 < DrDnar> Plus the one I mailed you.
04:38 < BrandonW> I keep meaning to put up a site for people to upload them.
04:40 < Randomist> DirectConnect?  BitTorrent?
04:40 < Randomist> FTP?
04:40 < BrandonW> I don't want a public FTP site for anyone to put whatever they want.
04:40 < BrandonW> It has to be a sane uploader.
04:41 < BrandonW> Checking to make sure it's a real certificate dump.
04:41 < Randomist> BrandonW:  Username and password, maybe?
04:41 < Randomist> And then have trusted uploaders.
04:41 < BrandonW> We've already established this is a stupid idea.
04:41 < DrDnar> It just has to make sure the calc ID is semi-real.
04:41 < Randomist> I tried.
04:41 < BrandonW> It's a simple PHP script.
04:41 < BrandonW> I just need to find the time to do it.
04:42 < BrandonW> DrDnar, I probably wouldn't do any checks on the actual data, because I'd be curious to see how people may have borked it.
04:43 < BrandonW> All my physical calculators have an empty certificate right now, not even a calc ID.
04:43 < DrDnar> Any reason why?
04:44 < millinao> why is it funny that I sent in 88 work units :(
04:45 < BrandonW> I'm not sure.
04:45 < BrandonW> DrDnar, I've been screwing with the certificate on all of them and it was quicker for me to just erase it than try and hunt down where the originals are.
04:45 < BrandonW> I have certificate dumps scattered everywhere.
04:46 < DrDnar> How many 8xs have you?
04:46 < BrandonW> 8xs?
04:47 < BrandonW> Oh, calculators.
04:47 < DrDnar> 83+/84
04:47 < BrandonW> Hm...
04:47 < BrandonW> I think it's a blue 83+, 83+SE, one black 84+, one clear 84+, one light blue 84+SE, and one gray/orange 84+SE.
04:47 < BrandonW> And one or two 83+ified 73s.
04:48 < DrDnar> The 73s have their own certificates too?
04:48 < BrandonW> Yes, but with an 83+ OS on them, it'll treat the certificate as if it were an 83+ certificate.
04:48  * Randomist commences drawing.
04:49 < BrandonW> The 73 certificates are about the same as an 83+ one (as far as I know) but with 02 as the start of the calc ID.
04:50 < DrDnar> So the 83ified 73s will display the same ID.
04:50 <@Nikky> :)
04:51 < BrandonW> They'll display whatever's in the certificate.
04:51 < BrandonW> If you kept the 73 one, you'll see 02.
04:51 < BrandonW> It's not smart to run with different ones like that, which is why Chameleon comes with a dummy one.
04:52 < BrandonW> And a program to do some cleanup.
04:52 < BrandonW> Since you have to use the battery trick and that really leaves things in an awkward state.
04:52 < BrandonW> There should be a generic program to clean up from an invalid OS like that.
04:53 < BrandonW> Chameleon would still require such a program even after the 73 OS key is cracked, because you'd have the 73 OS header in there for an 83+ OS.
04:53 < BrandonW> And the 83+ OS does check its own header from time to time.
04:53 < BrandonW> So I really have no idea what would happen if you left it.
04:53 < DrDnar> To what end?
04:53 < BrandonW> What are you asking?
04:53 < DrDnar> It just checks for the heck of it?
04:54 < BrandonW> It pulls some things from it if I remember correctly.
04:54 < BrandonW> The version, sometimes.
04:54 < BrandonW> The silent link packet that returns information might look at it.
04:54 < BrandonW> I can't remember exactly.
04:54 < BrandonW> I'd have to look.
04:55 < BrandonW> And it certainly uses it to transfer the OS from one calculator to another.
04:55 < BrandonW> I really have no idea if it would work or not with Chameleon as it stands.
04:55 < BrandonW> Even after the 73 OS key is cracked, you have to change the header oncalc, so you would have to re-sign it too if you wanted it to validate on another calculator.
04:55 < BrandonW> Someone really needs to attempt that powermod code.
04:56 < BrandonW> It would be so sweet to re-sign the OS ONCALC.
04:56 < BrandonW> And that's really what we should be doing anyway, with OS patches and the like.
04:56 < BrandonW> As well as fixing the checksum.
04:56 < BrandonW> So that you can easily send modifications to other calculators.
04:57 < BrandonW> That would be the true and ultimate goal to all this key cracking.
04:57 < BrandonW> Completely eliminating their security.
04:57 < j-b-r> I think you've gone mad with power
04:58 < DrDnar> To the 17th.
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05:07 < BrandonW> lol
05:08 < BrandonW> I have no understanding of the math involved or I'd do it myself.
05:08 < BrandonW> I don't even know if it's feasible for the calculator to do it.
05:11 < BrandonW> And I think I've disconnected from the internet.
05:12 < BrandonW> Or not.
05:13 < BrandonW> My connection is really sucking lately.
05:18 < Randomist> Do tell.
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05:19 < Randomist> I thought I'd fend off boredom once I came here.
05:19 < Randomist> It still laughs at me.
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05:53 < BrandonW> brandonw.net is down.
05:53 < BrandonW> I smell conspiracy.
05:54 < BrandonW> And now it's back.
05:55 -!- _Auron|FM [~DarkAuron@adsl-99-170-78-23.dsl.rcsntx.sbcglobal.net] has joined #tcpa
05:55 -!- mode/#tcpa [+o _Auron|FM] by efneTI86
05:55 < efneTI92> [_Auron|FM] We called it Sin.
05:56 < BrandonW> We might want to start posting MD5 hashes or signatures of all the OS versions to date.
05:56 < BrandonW> So it becomes possible to verify a TI-OS upgrade as valid or not.
05:56 < BrandonW> "valid" meaning straight from TI.
05:57 < Randomist> Cellophane hat time.
05:57 < BrandonW> I think I'm going to do that.
05:57 < BrandonW> And see if TI freaks out because lots of numbers are back on the page again.
05:57 -!- _Auron|FM is now known as _Auron_
05:57 < BrandonW> Even though they're hardly illegal.
05:58 < BrandonW> What's FM, _Auron_?
05:58 < millinao> frequency modulation, duh
05:58 <@_Auron_> mIRC decided to make my nick for everything _Auron|FML
05:58 <@_Auron_> but efnet cut off the L
05:58 <@_Auron_> stupid mIRC
05:59 < millinao> why fml?
05:59 <@_Auron_> I was super depressed last night
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06:05 < millinao> ah
06:06 <@_Auron_> sales have been good this week.
06:07 < BrandonW> That's good.
06:07 < Randomist> Are you, ah, "rollin' on thirty-twos" yet?
06:07 <@_Auron_> 2 on monday, 6 on tuesday, 6 yesterday, 4 today. those are full sales
06:07 < Randomist> ("Twos" or "two's?")
06:07 <@_Auron_> I have no idea wtf that's supposed to mean Randomist
06:08 < Randomist> Rapper ebonics.
06:08 < Randomist> Fancy car with large rims.
06:08 <@_Auron_> refunds I got were 3 on monday, 5 on tuesday, 4 yesterday, none today
06:09 <@_Auron_> in total 5 attempted sales monday, 11 on tuesday, 10 yesterday, and 4 today
06:10 < BrandonW> That's a lot. What are all the refunds for?
06:09 < BrandonW> People just being asshats?
06:10 <@_Auron_> I just pushed the 1.1 update with a subtle 'nag' screen in the demo tonight, which will hopefully have an influence on the 1,300 people that have it installed on their phones right now.
06:10 <@_Auron_> BrandonW: People not realizing there's a demo and buying, then refunding because they don't care for it.
06:10 < BrandonW> Thanks for letting me know not to ge the 1.1 update. :)
06:10 < BrandonW> get*
06:11 < Randomist> You're not supposed to say things like that.  :P
06:11 <@_Auron_> um, okay. 1.1 has completely revamped and balanced enemy spawns, and increases time limit to 2 minutes as opposed to 1m30s
06:11 < Randomist> Just silently implement them.
06:11 <@_Auron_> it shows the screen once every 5 game runs (ie selecting Start Game on the titlescreen = a game run)
06:12 <@_Auron_> after you die/quit a game
06:12 < millinao> i think he was being sarcastic
06:13 <@_Auron_> I often lack the ability to sense sarcasm.
06:14 < Randomist> Would you like to purchase a new Sarchasm Ultra?
06:14 <@_Auron_> no
06:21 <@_Auron_> oh I'm sorry, 5 sales today.
06:21  * _Auron_ just got another update
06:24  * Randomist runs away from Boredom.
06:24 < Randomist> Go away, go away, go away.
06:26  * Randomist draws this interpretation of boredom to alleviate the boredom.  :P
06:31 < Randomist> (I've lost it, haven't I?  :P)
06:31 < BrandonW> You never had it.
06:31 < Randomist> Good point.  :)
06:33 < Randomist> You're lucky, though, because you have calculators and math.
06:34 < Randomist> I have art and music, and some programming.
06:34 < Randomist> * just have
06:44 < BrandonW> http://brandonw.net/calcstuff/resign68k.zip This is a small console application to re-sign any 68k Flash application or OS upgrade using the key file you specify (key files at http://brandonw.net/keys.zip ).
06:44 < millinao> i'm going to compose a piece called boredom and just have a cello plucking the same note over and over again slowly
06:44 < BrandonW> For anyone who cares, you can now modify any 68k OS or application to your heart's content, or perhaps make your own.
06:44 < BrandonW> chronomex: whenever you get back, I think you might care about that.
06:44 < millinao> i think it should be an F
06:45 < BrandonW> Excepting 92+ Flash applications, of course, but we'll have the key soon enough for that.
06:49 <@chronomex> BrandonW: <3 thank you so much
06:50 <@chronomex> no, I don't have some fancy notifier set up ... I just cruised in a few minutes ago
06:51 < BrandonW> I also updated OS2Tools in /calcstuff/ to accept external key files.
06:51 <@chronomex> nice
06:51 < BrandonW> There's a GenerateSignature application in there you can use to quickly get a signature.
06:52 < BrandonW> Pass it a binary file and a key file, and you get a 020Dh signature field.
06:52 <@chronomex> mmm
06:53 < BrandonW> Which is just the signature in Little Endian with "020D40" tacked onto the front of it.
06:53 <@chronomex> right
06:53 <@chronomex> damnit I need cookies and the store is closed D:
06:54 < Randomist> millinao:  lol
06:55 < Randomist> They'll want to sign you for that.
06:55 < Randomist> You'll be rolling it in.
06:55 < millinao> you know i think they're an open mic soon
06:55 < millinao> they'res*
06:55 < Randomist> Today is the Age of Repetitive Music.
06:57 < BrandonW> there's*?
06:58 < Randomist> Correction-correction.
06:58 < Randomist> Objection!
07:09 < BrandonW> We should get 010A within the next 2 days. 0108 is almost done sieving, at which point we'll all start working on the 73 OS key (again). 0101 is in phase 3, hopefully being worked by somebody.
07:09 < BrandonW> After the 73 OS key, the group will start sieving the date stamp key and then we're done.
07:10  * Randomist grabs at hair to pull out, then realizes he has none.
07:10 <@_Auron_> ohshi
07:10 <@_Auron_> I just realized, I can sleep in for the first time all freakin' week
07:10 <@_Auron_> fuck
07:11 < Randomist> Sleep now, and forever hold you peace.
07:11 < Randomist> * your
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07:30 < nicolas> good morning
07:38 < _Digital> it still hasn't dropped below 80F and it is after midnight
07:42 <@_Auron_> 72F here but inside my room it feels like 85F
07:42 < _Digital> window open?
07:42 <@_Auron_> it's raining
07:42 <@_Auron_> my window faces north and the storm is coming from north
07:43 < _Digital> water cooling?
07:43 < _Digital> :P
07:43 <@_Auron_> lol
07:44 < _Digital> it's ironic
07:45 < _Digital> I wanted to move to water cooling before summer
07:45 < _Digital> but other fiscal anamolies would have it that I cannot complete that until after we start cooling
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08:35 < tr1p1ea> ahh the weekend
08:35 < tr1p1ea> :>
08:47 < Randomist> Aah, I feel better now.
08:48 < Randomist> My drawing turned out pretty good, too.  But I don't think I can put this on up.  Surely, some religious person would get mad.
08:49 < tr1p1ea> drawing?
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09:26 < efneTI92> [leofox] All we do in hell is play DDR!
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11:13 < Tar1> blaugh, friday morning
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11:35 < tr1p1ea> rofl friday night!
11:35 < tr1p1ea> oh how its good the week is over :)
11:36  * Tar1 is only semi-conscious
11:39 < Tar1> it _was_ rather neat to sit in the dining room and watch the sun rise as I ate breakfast..
11:50 < Tar1> aaaand time for class :(
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12:44 < efneTI92> [LordMathi] I'm not a ninja, no idea what you're talking about.
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12:49  * bsparks wants a spotify invite =/
12:52 < bsparks> alto, w00t unlimited bandwidth and storage :D
12:52 < bsparks> I have used [ according to cpanel, fucking cpanel ] 13gb of data transfers for the month of august
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12:59 < tr1p1ea> you owe them monies!
12:59 < tr1p1ea> err
13:25 < jr19> ah friday morning
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13:37 -!- mode/#tcpa [+v krisk] by SnowCrash, Remius
13:37 < jr19> hey krisk
13:38 <+krisk> hi
13:39 <+krisk> cool i already have an idea for the winning banner for www.picturesofducks.org
13:52 -!- i_c-Y [~Icy@pool-71-172-205-248.nwrknj.east.verizon.net] has joined #tcpa
13:52 < efneTI92> [i_c-Y] It's like I'm the last sane person on Earth.
13:54 < jr19> a picture of a duck?
13:58 <@E-J> i would suggest some painting made by kaj stenvall
13:58 <@E-J> http://www.kajstenvall.com/
14:00 < nicolas__> hmm... hwere are my C experts here
14:01 < nicolas__> well... IEEE 754 (floating point) experts
14:02 <@E-J> still sleeping?
14:02 <@E-J> or hiding
14:03 < nicolas__> heh, or both!
14:05 < nicolas__> I have an array:  float var_name[x][y]; ... and the code does a memset(var_name, 0, sizeof(var_name)); ... I'm just wondering if this is a correct way of initializing an array of floats to all 0
14:08 < Tar1> that should work fine
14:08 < Tar1> I don't know of any proper way to do it, but..
14:10 < nicolas__> seems like it should work fine ... as long as you don't happen to stumble across an old compiler that does all the math in software and doesn't use IEEE 754 floating points :P
14:12 < i_c-Y> i think id do float var_name[x][y]={{}};
14:12 < i_c-Y> err wait is this C or C++
14:13 < Tar1> C, it seems
14:13 -!- Tar1 is now known as Tari
14:14 < i_c-Y> gcc is happy to accept float var_name[x][y]={{}};
14:14 < nicolas__> i_c-Y, and automatically inits them all to 0?
14:15 < i_c-Y> well, its C++ actually, but that inits them to the default value of the type which is 0.
14:15 < i_c-Y> but if you're using gcc in non pedantic it'll accept it fine.
14:15 < nicolas__> hmm, well, in C++ that just calls the constructors in theory, I didn't know gcc allowed it in C .. maybe it's in C99 ?
14:16 < i_c-Y> you can do float var_name[x][y]={{0}}; and that should be fine
14:16 < nicolas__> hmm, which doesn't matter, I don't think this pgram uses C99 it was started in 97/98 I believe
14:16 < i_c-Y> i just wrote a short test program
14:16 < i_c-Y> and it works with C90
14:17 < i_c-Y> (what gcc 3.4.4 uses for -ansi)
14:17 < i_c-Y> also accepts it in c89 mode.
14:19 < nicolas__> yeah: http://stackoverflow.com/questions/201101/how-to-initialize-an-array-in-c
14:20 < nicolas__> "And that "0" doesn't necessarily mean "all-bits-zero", so using the above is better and more portable than memset()."
14:20 < nicolas__> <3 stack overflow :)
14:21 < i_c-Y> actually that doesnt work
14:21 < i_c-Y> itll just set the first element to 0
14:22 < i_c-Y> or will it
14:23 < i_c-Y> i need to actually look at the C standard - if not, dual for loops is probably teh best way to go
14:25 < i_c-Y> i thought the partial initialization forced it to be all 0's though
14:26 < i_c-Y> yep
14:26 < i_c-Y> nicolas_: its fine
14:26 < i_c-Y> you can do flot b[4] = {0}; and guarantee all the floats are 0
14:27 < nicolas__> yeah
14:28 < i_c-Y> my brain is clearly not working today
14:28 < nicolas__> {{0}} should work as well, since I have defined both dimensions, right ?
14:28  * nicolas__ goes to try it
14:28 < i_c-Y> it should.
14:29 < nicolas__> well, gcc certainly ididn't complain
14:30 < i_c-Y> well gcc is a whore afterall.
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14:35 < jr19> a dirty, filthy whore
14:36 < i_c-Y> nicolas_: it looks like its definitely valid C99 but nobody seems to have the bloody 89 or whatever standard - gcc doesn't complain about it with -pedantic and -ansi though so 
14:37 < nicolas__> well, considering the original code was doing it with a memset... i'll go with this slightly more standard way
14:43 < i_c-Y> memset works fine assuming you know that the machine will use IEEE 754 floating point (which isn't required of course). atleast you can put a newer compiler on the thing and you should be mostly good to go (int main() vs main() for ex are some changes that may need to be made)
14:45 < i_c-Y> though  c99 apparantly guarantees IEEE 754 according to the internets
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15:11 <@E-J> http://kuvaton.com/kuvei/conversation.png
15:20 < Tari> win
15:21 < tr1p1ea> if only that were real
15:22 < Tari> quiet, you
15:23 -!- Netsplit hub.dk <-> irc.efnet.pl quits: seidior, tr1p1ea, nicolas_, TD-Linux, Mwyann, BrandonW
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15:24 < tr1p1ea_> wb
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15:31 -!- mode/#tcpa [+v Goplat] by SnowCrash
15:32 < Tari> no u
15:34 <@E-J> http://www.moonsorrow.com/henu/TEMP/studio/ARE%20WE%20THERE%20YET.htm
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16:01 <@Andy_J> http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=112312561
16:01 <@Andy_J> D:
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16:04 < efneTI92> [i_c-Y] It's like I'm the last sane person on Earth.
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16:06 < Barrett> http://digg.com/political_opinion/Baron_Hill_This_Is_My_Town_Hall_Meeting_I_Set_the_Rules
16:07 < tr1p1ea_> err ign have a 'top 25 consoles of all time' list goin
16:08 < tr1p1ea_> n64 at 9, ps1 at 7
16:08 < tr1p1ea_> xbo360 at 6 ...
16:08 < tr1p1ea_> rofl
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16:20 < jr19> dreamcast at #1
16:21 < jr19> play burned games, no mod chip required!
16:22 -!- nicolas__ [~nicolas@proxy.acri.fr] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
16:23 < tr1p1ea_> argued that halo1 started console fps and not goldeneye
16:23 < tr1p1ea_> made no mention of zelda oot
16:23 < tr1p1ea_> or mgs on ps1
16:24 < tr1p1ea_> and stated that 360 was revolutionary since it outputs in a higher resolution
16:24 < tr1p1ea_> that halo wars is the best game ever
16:24 < tr1p1ea_> and that their fondest memories included when their console rrod'd
16:24 < tr1p1ea_> ....
16:25 < tr1p1ea_> what better way to say "im a gaming journalist and ive only played xbo1 and xbox 360"
16:28 < jr19> yeah pretty much
16:28 < jr19> how the hell can you not mention goldeneye when talking about console FPS
16:28 < jr19> perfect dark was pretty good too
16:28 < tr1p1ea_> yeh
16:30 < tr1p1ea_> ps3 is like #15
16:30 < tr1p1ea_> lol
16:30 < jr19> i have a ps3
16:30 < tr1p1ea_> clearly the article is ps3 fan bait
16:30 < jr19> i've never even played an xbox360
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16:30 < jr19> i dont play many games though
16:31 < tr1p1ea_> neither, i dont have time
16:31 < jr19> i just like being able to de-stress every so often by shooting people online or something
16:31 < tr1p1ea_> and when i do have time, i cant be bothered
16:31 < jr19> i hardly ever have time and when i do, i usually have other things to do that are more appealing
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16:52 <+krisk> in after no mention of Ghost Recon for PS2
16:52 <+krisk> what did they put on #1? Wii or 360?
16:56 < jr19> wii is #10
16:56 < jr19> looks like they've only made it to #6 so far
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17:03 < efneTI92> [Randomist] CAUTION:  Exposure to this user may cause neurological damage.
17:23 -!- DrDnar [~DrDnar@c-24-35-66-83.customer.broadstripe.net] has joined #tcpa
17:24 <+krisk> yawn
17:24 <+krisk> so what's up this here weekend?
17:25 <@chronomex> penny arcade expo for all the gametards in seattle
17:25 < jr19> playing golf tomorrow, baseball sunday night, and relaxing on monday (labor day)
17:25 <+krisk> cool cool
17:25 <@chronomex> oh yeah 3day :O
17:25 < jr19> don't know what i'm doing tonight
17:25 <+krisk> im gonna play pool tonight and go to the birthday party of my best girlyfriend
17:25 <+krisk> tomorrow
17:25 <@chronomex> I think I'm going to do some more usb reverse-engineering maybe
17:26 <+krisk> 3 days?
17:26 < jr19> you play a lot of pool
17:26 <+krisk> theres fuck all else to do here
17:26 < jr19> do you ever play in tournaments
17:26 <@chronomex> krisk: monday is a holiday
17:26 <+krisk> its either that or go see a movie or be a drunk failtard slut in a club
17:26 <+krisk> what is monday?
17:26 < jr19> or do drugs
17:26 <+krisk> and/or do drugs
17:26 < jr19> monday is labor day in the US
17:26 <+krisk> which aint all that bad
17:26 <+krisk> ah
17:27 <@chronomex> first holiday since early july
17:27 < jr19> won't have another one until november...
17:27 <@chronomex> yup yup
17:27 <+krisk> I think I'm gonna rent a cheap hotel room for myself for saturday next weekend, there's two cool goa parties that night and I think Ill go to one of them by myself and crash in the room when it's over/i find out its no good
17:28 < jr19> unless you work at bank and you get columbus day off in october
17:28 <+krisk> both are really well known and recommended, one is on a beach and the other in a club so the latter will be the most likely since weather wont be any good
17:28 <@chronomex> damn bankers
17:28 < jr19> what makes you say that the weather won't be any good
17:29 <+krisk> because its been raining and cloudy and lightning the past two weeks
17:29 < jr19> maybe that means you are due for some nicer weather
17:29 <+krisk> it was nice before that
17:29 <@chronomex> BrandonW_: http://books.google.com/books?id=OSnynlQrvVcC  <-- I'm going to go get a copy of this book from my uni's library
17:30 < jr19> "light rain shower and windy" in amsterdam according to weather.com
17:30 < jr19> its supposed to clear up next week though
17:30 < jr19> i dont know how close to amsterdam beach place is
17:30 <+krisk> netherlands is small so anything is close enough weather-wise
17:30 <@chronomex> BrandonW_: then hopefully I will understand USB
17:31 < jr19> hmmm....amsterdam's climate seems kinda like the pacific northwest here
17:31 <+krisk> looks like rain this weekend and just clouds next week
17:31 <+krisk> so maybe the beach party will remain an option
17:31 < jr19> maybe...
17:31 <+krisk> will be further away from hotels though
17:31 <+krisk> cheap ones anyway
17:31 < jr19> you probably dont get much snow there eh?
17:32 <+krisk> some winters we get a bit
17:32 < jr19> i see, we get a lot usually
17:32 <+krisk> usually it wont stay on the ground though
17:32 <+krisk> so its basically just white rain
17:32 < jr19> due to moist air from the gulf and cold air from canada converging or something
17:32 <+krisk> hmmk
17:32 < jr19> i'm going to lunch now, bb in 1hr
17:32 <+krisk> cya
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18:16 <+sir_lewk> hello pimpettes
18:16 <+krisk> hi
18:17 <+sir_lewk> anything cool and exciting going on?
18:20 <+krisk> yeah im looking forward to a birthday party tomorrow
18:21 < i_c-Y> yay, someone is a year closer to dying as measured from their birth.
18:21 <+sir_lewk> is it your birthday?
18:21 <+krisk> no it is not
18:21 <+sir_lewk> oh, oh well
18:22 <+sir_lewk> free cake anyways :)
18:22 <+krisk> its my best friend's girlfriend - who is my bestest girl friend -'s birthday party
18:22 < leofox> cool
18:22 <+sir_lewk> indeed
18:22 <+krisk> i got her some Wii-attachment things for those sports games on the Wii
18:22 <+krisk> and a card of course
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18:30 <+sir_lewk> you got a girl a wii attachment for her birthday?  kinky :P
18:31 <+krisk> ^______________^
18:32 <+sir_lewk> lol
18:42 < jr19> aight
18:43 < jr19> i have a good picture for lolcat usage here, but it's probably too crappy of quality considering its a scan
18:44 <+krisk> dont call them lolcats ~_~
18:44 -!- boscop [boscop@g230110090.adsl.alicedsl.de] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
18:45 <+krisk> also, concerning the earlier subject: http://img98.imageshack.us/img98/3535/1251893779960.jpg
18:45 < jr19> why no lolcat
18:53 < jr19> KRISK
18:53 <+krisk> wat5
18:53 < jr19> i asked you a question heh
18:53 <+krisk> just bcause
18:54 < jr19> heh ok
18:54 <+krisk> its lame
18:54 < jr19> its how they are referred to generally
18:54 <+krisk> yeah by lame people who caught on because icanhazcheeseburger failsite popularized it outside 4chan
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18:55 < jr19> lol
18:55 < jr19> what else would you call them
18:55 < jr19> pictures of cats
18:55 < jr19> picturesofcats.org
18:59 < leofox> oh wow
18:59 < leofox> i feel so arty
18:59 < leofox> I recorded the sounds from my keyboard without actually hearing what I played
18:59 < leofox> it sounds like pure shite
19:01 < jr19> i have a digital piano at home
19:01 < jr19> but i dont know how to play
19:01 <+krisk> doesnt it sound awfull even if you can hear what you play?
19:01 < jr19> i play guitar into my microphone and sing sometimes just to see how it sounds to an outside person, it's interesting
19:02 < leofox> krisk: I can actually play the piano
19:02 <+krisk> ah ok
19:02 <+krisk> how are you enjoying your bong?
19:02 < leofox> it's pretty nice
19:02 < leofox> I tried it wednesday
19:02 < jr19> i wish i was enjoying it
19:03 < leofox> jr19 you could be sitting here being stoned as hell right now
19:03 < leofox> if you didnt live in the US
19:03 < jr19> i could be
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19:05 < jr19> i'd probably be enjoying life a little more
19:05 < jr19> if that were the case
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19:11 <+krisk> you dont have to be stoned off your ass to enjoy life
19:11 < leofox> it helps though
19:12 <+krisk> it helps when you have4 nothing esle to appreciate
19:12 < jr19> well i'd enjoy work a lot more
19:12 <+krisk> i'll take a free beautifull sunny morning in a nice place over any joint any time
19:12 < jr19> i enjoy life, but i mean, i'd probably enjoy my current situation better if weed was involved
19:13 < jr19> due to having to sit at a desk and stare at a computer screen with not much to do
19:13 <+krisk> no, then you'd enjoy the weed
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19:14 <+krisk> 30 minutes bussride to college in winter with mp3 player while half-asleep in the cozey heat is also bliss
19:14 < jr19> ah winter
19:14 < jr19> i'm not looking forward to it
19:14 < jr19> driving on shitty snow covered roads
19:14 < jr19> worrying about whether or not someone is going to slide into me
19:14 <+krisk> snow <3
19:15 < jr19> snow is nice at first, but it gets old really quick when you live here
19:15 <+krisk> also, chilling in hot shower with no time limit is bliss
19:15 < jr19> yeah that is good as long as the water stays hot
19:15 <+krisk> and having a sandwich with a glass of milk in bed in the middle of the night
19:17 < jr19> not bliss
19:18 < jr19> unless i was already awake before hand
19:18 < jr19> but if i wake up and have to eat a sandwich, i am annoyed
19:18 <+krisk> hmm idk when i wake up at night i am immedeately fully awake and full of energy but when i wake up in the morning to go to work i am half dead
19:19 <+krisk> waking up because you have to pee and then realising you're hungry -> eat sandwich
19:21 <+krisk> although mj does help you get more towards the same relaxed state as those things do
19:23 < BrandonW_> chronomex: that book will help with the overview, but not the low-level stuff you're going to have to deal with in code.
19:24 < jr19> i suppose
19:24 < jr19> waking up to take a good pee during the night isn't so bad as long as i can get back to sleep easily
19:24 <+krisk> sure
19:26 < jr19> i think me and the ex might be getting back together
19:26 <+krisk> fo real?
19:27 < jr19> yeah
19:27 <+krisk> home come?
19:28 <+krisk> wat
19:28 <+krisk> *how come
19:28 < jr19> well i still like her and everything but i told her awhile back that she needed to decide what she wanted
19:28 <+krisk> yeah
19:28 < jr19> and i think being away for a couple months now has had a bit of an effect on her
19:28 <+krisk> for the better?
19:30 < jr19> yeah
19:30 < jr19> she is around for our kid now more than she was around when she was living here it seems
19:30 <+krisk> heh cool i guess
19:31 < jr19> we'll see what happens i guess, she was over at my place last night
19:31 <+krisk> whatever is better is better, right
19:31 < BrandonW_> I've started getting 73 OS key work units, without computation errors.
19:31 -!- incubus [incubus__@98.194.19.98] has joined #tcpa
19:31 < jr19> well i havent told her to come back yet because i want to make sure i am thinking rationally about that things instead of with emotions
19:32 <+krisk> haha yeah thats gonna happen
19:32 < BrandonW_> Somehow I got a Titanium OS key work unit a couple of hours ago.
19:32 < incubus> God I hate people that make a smack/clicking sound between the time they stop talking, and the time they start talking
19:32 < incubus> BrandonW_, mm
19:32 < BrandonW_> We definitely have two keys in the middle of final processing, and the other three are on BOINC.
19:32 < BrandonW_> So we're in the home stretch.
19:33 <+krisk> - Your mp3 will now bypass the WMG copyright filter on Youtube
19:33 <+krisk> :o
19:35 < incubus> BrandonW_, what is tita workloads?
19:35 < incubus> what are*
19:36 < BrandonW_> That's the 89 Titanium, either OS or app key (I think OS).
19:36 < BrandonW_> They tend to put "fa" on the app kyes.
19:36 < BrandonW_> keys.*
19:36 < incubus> I thought we had the 89T OS key cracked
19:36  * incubus checks
19:36 < BrandonW_> We do.
19:36 <+krisk> fa app keys
19:36 < BrandonW_> Which is why it's unusual.
19:36 <+krisk> read quickly
19:36  * incubus shrugs
19:36 < BrandonW_> We have all OS keys (except the 73).
19:37 < incubus> krisk, talking to me?
19:37 < BrandonW_> The 89Ti is completely cracked.
19:37 <+krisk> fappkeys
19:37 < incubus> krisk, ?
19:37 < BrandonW_> He's just making a dirty joke.
19:37 < incubus> ooooh
19:38 <+krisk> just something i noticed while reading BrandonW_'s sentence earlier
19:38 < incubus> my mind just isn't there right now
19:38 < BrandonW_> My mind is on the keys.
19:38 < incubus> same
19:38 < incubus> and on getting underground information from BrandonW_ :D
19:38 < BrandonW_> I have a utility to test the date stamp key, and the 84+/92+/V200 app keys are easy to test now.
19:39 < BrandonW_> The one I'm not sure on is the 73 OS key.
19:39 < incubus> BrandonW_, do you know who is working on the shirt project so I can keep poking them with a stick?
19:39 < BrandonW_> I'm not sure anyone's doing it anymore. chronomex was designing it.
19:39 < incubus> sigh
19:40 <+Netham45> what shirt project?
19:40 < BrandonW_> A t-shirt we can buy with the factors on it.
19:41 < incubus> and I'm going to send one to Herbert Foster
19:41 < incubus> With a comment like "I made this extra large, because I would consider you a huge asshole"
19:41 <+Netham45> haha
19:42 <+krisk> thats pretty cool haha
19:42 <+krisk> thats pretty cool haha
19:42 <+krisk> woops
19:42 < BrandonW_> We really need to start thinking of the "what now?" part of this once we get the keys. I'm thinking of writing a .key file generator to take copy-pastes from Wikileaks to make .key files.
19:43 < incubus> lol
19:44 < incubus> I took this pic, does anyone get it? http://img54.imageshack.us/img54/1367/taillight.jpg
19:44 < BrandonW_> Because all the stuff we get from this, we're going to have to come up with ways of providing it but not really providing it.
19:44 < incubus> lol
19:45 < BrandonW_> incubus, I uploaded a utility to re-sign any 68k application or OS upgrade at http://brandonw.net/calcstuff/resign68k.zip
19:45 < incubus> nice
19:45 < BrandonW_> Provided you have the right key file from http://brandonw.net/keys.zip
19:45 < incubus> haha
19:46 < incubus> which you can't provide
19:46 < BrandonW_> Hence the problem.
19:46 < BrandonW_> It just depends on how they get posted to Wikileaks.
19:46 < incubus> I was thinking we could produce ordinary objects with orientations that could be interpreted as the key values
19:46 < BrandonW_> We could go with the current n= p= q= e= d= format, which requires a utility to get it in .key format, or just upload the .key files.
19:47 < BrandonW_> And even then, we can't provide the link to the Wikileaks article.
19:47 < BrandonW_> But I think we could say "Go find it on Wikileaks"
19:47 < BrandonW_> It just concerns me that that one guy got a DMCA notice for simply linking to ticalc.org.
19:47 < BrandonW_> Which contains no factors.
19:47 < incubus> WOW
19:47 < incubus> ARE YOU JOKING?
19:47 < BrandonW_> And except for the unitedti.org forum, also contains no links to the factors.
19:48 < BrandonW_> No, that happened.
19:48 < BrandonW_> The guy sent his own response and posted another article about it.
19:48 < incubus> why can't we just imbed them in png images
19:48 < BrandonW_> Which still mentions ticalc.org but no longer has the link.
19:48 < incubus> embed**
19:48 < BrandonW_> Because that's extremely difficult to rip back out for most people.
19:48 < BrandonW_> The idea is to make this idiot-proof.
19:48 < incubus> you can't make it idiot-proof and underground
19:48 < incubus> it has to be partially obscured, requiring some thought
19:49 < incubus> What if gave out locations in PI that concatenated would result in the keys?
19:49 < BrandonW_> I disagree. Very simple instructions to go find a post on Wikileaks, copy-and-paste what's there into a utility, and take the .key file from it and put it in your development environment...I could see it.
19:50 < incubus> will the post be the literal values, or an obscured code
19:50 < incubus> ?
19:50 < BrandonW_> The post will be the real values. Go to the article now to see the 2-3 keys currently on there.
19:50 < incubus> they're just going to send DMCA's to wikileaks
19:50 < BrandonW_> http://88.80.16.63/leak/ti-os-keys-dmca-2009.txt
19:51 < BrandonW_> They can send DMCAs all they want, they're not going down.
19:51 < BrandonW_> It's Wikileaks.
19:51 < incubus> Does wikileaks have a strong offshore ISP? :)
19:51 < BrandonW_> The Pentagon has gone after them before.
19:51 < BrandonW_> They cannot be taken down.
19:51 < incubus> lol!!
19:51 < incubus> nice!
19:51 < BrandonW_> They're not even sure who runs it.
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19:51 < incubus> lmfao!
19:51 < incubus> that's absurdly golden
19:51 < BrandonW_> That's the PURPOSE of the site.
19:51 < BrandonW_> To release stuff like this.
20:01 < millinao> i hate transcoding formats
20:01 < BrandonW_> There are only three formats for the keys, the prp** factors in decimal, the n= p= q= stuff, and the .key files themselves.
20:02 < BrandonW_> I think a small utility to take p and q in any number format that spits out a .key file would be fine.
20:02 < millinao> I was talking about audio formats :P
20:03 < BrandonW_> I think I might even make it a web page to piss off TI.
20:04 < Randomist> YaouTube video.
20:05 < incubus> lol
20:06 < BrandonW_> You know...
20:06 < BrandonW_> I think I will.
20:06 < BrandonW_> A "screw you, we've won" gloating video.
20:06 < millinao> you're such a rebel
20:06 < Randomist> He is a rebel with a cause.
20:08 < BrandonW_> I can't wait to make that post on brandonw.net.
20:08 < BrandonW_> Once we have all the keys.
20:09 <@_Auron_> great, Stroids is being pirated
20:09 < BrandonW_> How's that?
20:09 < BrandonW_> I would be flattered.
20:10 <@_Auron_> I've been told it's on droidappz.com
20:11 < BrandonW_> It doesn't seem to load for me.
20:12 < BrandonW_> But like, what are they doing? Taking the actual game off a device it was bought from and then distributing it?
20:12 < BrandonW_> As an APK file or something?
20:14 <@_Auron_> buying, pulling the apk, refunding, and distrubiting
20:14 -!- kirsk [~krisk@host064-001.kpn-gprs.nl] has joined #tcpa
20:14 < BrandonW_> Do you have to honor refunds?
20:14 <@_Auron_> google checkout does not charge until after 24 hours, in which the refund cannot be done
20:14 <@_Auron_> technically it's not a refund
20:15 -!- kirsk [~krisk@host064-001.kpn-gprs.nl] has quit [Client Quit]
20:15 <@_Auron_> it's just a removal of the app from the device and prevention of sale
20:15 <@_Auron_> "refunds" can only be done once per app per user. if they buy, refund, then buy again, they cannot refund a second time
20:16 <@_Auron_> apple on the other hand charges immediately with its iphone app market, and if the user initiates a refund, the author has to give back 100%, despite apple taking 30% of the sale originally. which is horrible IMO
20:16 -!- TheStorm [~TheStorm@CPE-70-92-241-13.wi.res.rr.com] has joined #tcpa
20:16 < efneTI92> [TheStorm] Yes rivereye, it is time to go fishing.
20:20 < BrandonW_> Certainly sounds like it.
20:20 < BrandonW_> I can't understand the concept of refunds on these things anyway.
20:21 < BrandonW_> If you buy it, you're stuck with it.
20:26 <@_Auron_> the idea is if it's a pay-only app with no demo/lite/etc versions, you can 'try before you buy'
20:26 <@_Auron_> but most people put up demo versions anyways
20:27 <@_Auron_> this is better than apple, who takes 30% of the sale and expects you to pay 100% back to the customer at your loss and apple's benefit. total bullshit there.
20:29 < BrandonW_> If you put up a demo version, you should have the option to disable refunds.
20:31 < BrandonW_> We're almost done with 0108 (V200 app key).
20:31 < BrandonW_> We're all sieving 02 (73 OS key).
20:31 < BrandonW_> I think I have some code ready to verify it.
20:31 <@_Auron_> BrandonW_: Hmm, that's honestly a good idea :|
20:32 < BrandonW_> They're rare, but I do have them.
20:32 < BrandonW_> With no ability to disable refunds, I would have no motivation at all to create a demo version.
20:33 <@_Auron_> demo version doesn't take much work on my part, and honestly it adds extra exposure to those that are unsure
20:35 < BrandonW_> I would make it really really annoying to use.
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20:46 < BrandonW_> There's something we don't know, because TI can validate a calc ID on their web site. The only way to do that is some sort of algorithm we don't know about, or they have the factors for that calculator's public key and are validating it with the signature (last 4 digits).
20:47 < BrandonW_> I guess the only thing left to try, really, is to start factoring calculator public keys.
20:48 < BrandonW_> And see if there's a pattern.
20:56 < BrandonW_> But I very much doubt it.
20:56 < BrandonW_> There's just too much math to satisfy to throw in some sort of calc ID relation.
20:57 < BrandonW_> So screw it, we'll change everyone's public key to 0005 and sign 8XQ files with that.
21:00 < BrandonW_> Once we have a program that can actually create 8XQ files.
21:00 < BrandonW_> Or some documentation on how they work.
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21:20 < BrandonW_> That's kind of sad, Benjamin Moody stopped sieving over a week ago.
21:20 < BrandonW_> He really is completely done.
21:20 < BrandonW_> I hope he's still maintaining RabbitSign.
21:21  * Randomist wonders if there happens to be an ALSA guru around...
21:31 < tev> Here's a table I made yesterday of the TI-81's wacky character set, for anyone who's curious: http://members.cox.net/travisgevans/tmp/ti81_charset.txt
21:31 < incubus> BrandonW_, why did he stop sieving?
21:32 < tev> Someone might want to post it somewhere more permanent.
21:32 < BrandonW_> He was ordered to have nothing further to do with the project.
21:32 < incubus> DAMN
21:32 < incubus> BrandonW_, what if you are next? O_o
21:32 < BrandonW_> I hadn't dedicated a single CPU cycle to the project until a week or so ago.
21:33 < incubus> BrandonW_, what if they ban you from ever using/discussing/programming for TI devices?
21:33 < BrandonW_> Then I'll use an alias and release things elsewhere.
21:33 < BrandonW_> I'm not stopping.
21:33 < incubus> :D
21:34 < incubus> sorry I somewhat forced you to join the boinc project
21:34 < incubus> you could have at least used an alias ON THAT
21:34 < BrandonW_> I have 2 or 3 PCs on it.
21:34 < BrandonW_> I would have this one on it too but I'd have to restart.
21:34 < Randomist> Ordered by Texas Instruments?
21:34 < leofox> BrandonW_: ahh, so thats why you're gaining way more credit than me
21:35 < incubus> I have 3 comps on it
21:35 < BrandonW_> Yes.
21:35 < incubus> leofox, lol me and BrandonW_ crushed you
21:35 < leofox> I should probably install boinc on the server thats doing nothing now
21:35 < incubus> probably.
21:35 < leofox> but it probably wouldnt do any good, that machine is weeeeeaaaaak
21:35 < incubus> :(
21:35 < leofox> intel celeron from 6 years ago weak
21:36 < leofox> my current PC is pretty weak too but at least it has a decent gpu to make up for it
21:36 < jr19> ok
21:36 < jr19> all my PCs suck
21:36 < BrandonW_> I have a 2.6GHz Celeron laptop I could put on it.
21:37 < incubus> :D
21:37 < incubus> I want to put my mobile phone on it but they don't have a  sweet mobile boinc client yet
21:38 < jr19> i have a 1.1ghz pentium 3 with 192mb of RAM at home that is just collecting dust...it must be good for something.
21:39 < TheStorm> jr19, Home Server, Media Center?
21:39 < jr19> i'm not sure if it has a good use
21:39 < leofox> how much does the speed of your gpu matter on these things?
21:39 < leofox> like
21:40 < leofox> is it mostly my gpu doing the work, or my cpu?
21:40 < incubus> cpu
21:40 < incubus> by far
21:40 < leofox> ok
21:40 < incubus> do you have a supported GPU?
21:40 < leofox> yeah
21:40 < leofox> i have the 9600GT
21:40 < BrandonW_> There is no GPU client that I know of.
21:40 < BrandonW_> For this project.
21:40 < incubus> BrandonW_, it's built into the client
21:40 < BrandonW_> And the sieving code has been ported to it?
21:40 < incubus> Advanced -> Preferences
21:40 < leofox> I'm asking because I changed the settings to only use half of my CPU
21:40 < leofox> but the amount of work it did didnt really decreate
21:40 < leofox> *decrease
21:41 < BrandonW_> I'm pretty sure you have to recompile the sieving code for it and it hasn't been.
21:40 < TheStorm> ^
21:41 < incubus> BrandonW_, I would assume the sieving code will interface with the client in such a way that it would be oblivious to how the actual processing is being handled
21:41 < Tari> heck no
21:41 < BrandonW_> You assume incorrectly.
21:41 < incubus> then it's a FAIL design
21:41  * incubus stabs everyone
21:41 < BrandonW_> Maybe YOU'RE fail.
21:41 < leofox> I assumed it would at least use my gpu too
21:41 < leofox> because my CPU kind of sucks
21:42 < incubus> BrandonW_, wouldn't be too much of a stretch to declare that
21:42 < BrandonW_> There was some CUDA talk on the yAronet thread.
21:41 < leofox> it's by far the weakest component of this system
21:42 < BrandonW_> But I don't think it's going anywhere.
21:42 < BrandonW_> They're moving the project to the Mersennes forum (I think that's right) to further expand on it as a generic integer factorization method.
21:42 < BrandonW_> To improve it and whatnot.
21:42 < BrandonW_> Once we're done with the keys.
21:42 <@_Auron_> hum, just got 5mil points on hard mode in my game
21:42 < incubus> BrandonW_, the Mersennes project?!?! omg
21:43 < incubus> very very nice
21:43 <@_Auron_> oh fun
21:43 < incubus> they have lots of peeps
21:43 <@_Auron_> droidapps.com was suspended
21:44  * Randomist has a new surround system.
21:44 < incubus> I hope they don't destroy Brandonw.net
21:44 < BrandonW_> I'm sure they won't.
21:44 < Randomist> Hopefully, I don't blow this one out, too.  :P
21:44 < BrandonW_> I don't intend to put the keys on there publicly.
21:45 < BrandonW_> There's no reason to take it down.
21:45 < incubus> 'because we said so' ?
21:46 < Randomist> More like, because "there's some money in it for you if you take him down."
21:46 < incubus> oh yah and that
21:46 -!- aksnowman [~MrSmith@rdbk-14180.mtaonline.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]
21:48 -!- aksnowman [~MrSmith@rdbk-12444.mtaonline.net] has joined #tcpa
21:53 < BrandonW_> They can't take it down without a good reason.
21:53 < BrandonW_> Just look at all the stuff that's been released to date.
21:53 < BrandonW_> RabbitSign was released ages ago and fully allows signing applications and OSes for everything.
21:53 < BrandonW_> Or at least it claims to.
21:53 < BrandonW_> It just doesn't include the key files.
21:54 -!- BrandonW_ is now known as BrandonW
21:54 < BrandonW> Their DMCA notices say no whole or partical reproductions of or enabled links to the United TI thread.
21:54 < BrandonW> I can release all the tools I want and say where to get the key files.
21:54 < BrandonW> If they have a problem with that, they can send me another bogus letter.
21:54 < BrandonW> And I'm much more likely to fight that.
21:56 < BrandonW> And I already posted OS2 to another United TI post, signed with the 0A key.
21:56 < BrandonW> Still silence from TI.
21:56 < BrandonW> How they haven't taken down United TI, I just do not understand.
21:56 < BrandonW> There are at least 3 or 4 keys in that thread.
21:56 < BrandonW> Frankly I think they just want to avoid embarrassment.
22:05 < BrandonW> Now we see if they can find http://brandonw.net/svn/calcstuff/OS2/trunk/04.key and http://brandonw.net/svn/calcstuff/OS2/trunk/0A.key
22:14 -!- Barrett [~Barrett@75-165-243-149.slkc.qwest.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]
22:20 <@chronomex> BrandonW: yeah, the book isn't very good lowlevel, but 1) the lib didn't have any better D:, and 2) I can read other peoples' code for that
22:20 < BrandonW> Believe it or not, the USB spec itself is very good.
22:20 < BrandonW> For skimming.
22:21 < BrandonW> Certain sections.
22:30 < BrandonW> Apparently I didn't sign it right, so for anyone interested in the Zoom Math 200 crack ( http://brandonw.net/crap/Zoom200.zip ) it's now fixed.
22:32 -!- Genolo [~birds@69.177.4.6] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out]
22:35 -!- aksnowman [~MrSmith@rdbk-12444.mtaonline.net] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out]
22:37 -!- aksnowman [~MrSmith@rdbk-12444.mtaonline.net] has joined #tcpa
22:37 -!- Randomist [~winterven@216.117.123.109] has quit [Quit: leaving]
22:38 <@chronomex> BrandonW: where can I get a copy of the USB spec? is it free online, or do they want $800?
22:38 < BrandonW> It's free online at usb.org.
22:38 < BrandonW> As well as the HID, MSD, and all the other specs.
22:39 <@chronomex> fantastic
22:40 < BrandonW> We really need a certificate parsing thing.
22:40 < BrandonW> Tari was working on one.
22:40 < Tari> yeah, I haven't touched it in a while
22:41 <@chronomex> 15:04:23 [2600] -Global(services@2600.net)- It's that time again, www.2600.com/meetings/ . Report to your nearest sleeper cell.
22:42 <@chronomex> heh
22:43 < BrandonW> I'm just trying to think of a sane interface for such a thing.
22:44 < BrandonW> I mean, I guess it would just be a tree view.
22:44 <@chronomex> yeah
22:45 <@chronomex> ooh
22:45 <@chronomex> have you ever used wireshark?
22:45 -!- Randomist [~winterven@216.117.121.227] has joined #tcpa
22:45 < efneTI92> [Randomist] CAUTION:  Exposure to this user may cause neurological damage.
22:45 <@chronomex> they have a treeview and a hexview that get highlighted in sync
22:45 < BrandonW> Hm.
22:46 < BrandonW> Not since it was Wireshark.
22:46 <@chronomex> same as in whatever it was before that
22:47 < BrandonW> I'm guessing a tree view with another pane that's hex editory with all the data you currently have highlighted.
22:47 < BrandonW> So you can copy/paste/whatever.
22:48 <+Netham45> using wireshark for the first time, chronomex?
22:48 < BrandonW> No, he was just referring to its interface.
22:48 < BrandonW> For me.
22:48 <+Netham45> ah.
22:48 < BrandonW> Read the buffer, you insensitive clod.
22:48 <+Netham45> I actually have, back to "<BrandonW> Their DMCA notices say no whole or partical reproductions of or enabled links to the United TI thread."
22:49 <+Netham45> but, I missed where you're talking about an interface, until 3 seconds ago.
22:49 < Tari> yeah, I'm using a tree view
22:49 < Tari> the basic UI is up
22:50 < Tari> and hopefully it knows the basics of parsing the certificate
22:50 < BrandonW> Do you think you could screenshot it?
22:50 < Tari> basically just need the logic to populate the tree >.<
22:50 <+sir_lewk> I just blew through my CS final in 45 minutes (2 hour final)
22:50 <+sir_lewk> it's been 10 minutes and still nobody else has finished :)
22:50 < BrandonW> I remember CS fianls like that.
22:51 < BrandonW> finals*
22:51 <+Netham45> lol, nice, sir_lewk.
22:51 <@chronomex> okay, time to help some girl move house
22:51  * chronomex afk
22:51 <+sir_lewk> whoa, moving a whole house? impressive :P
22:51 -!- Randomist [~winterven@216.117.121.227] has quit [Client Quit]
22:51 -!- kirsk [~krisk@host064-001.kpn-gprs.nl] has joined #tcpa
22:52 < kirsk> bloop
22:52 <+Netham45> ploop.
22:52 <@_Auron_> I helped move a whole house several times over the summer
22:52 <+sir_lewk> for real?
22:52 <@_Auron_> mhm
22:52 < Tari> http://taricorp.net/media/uploads/pub/certutil_design.png
22:52 < kirsk> i accidentally a whole house
22:52 <+sir_lewk> that kind of stuff is seriously awesome
22:53 < Tari> that's my layout, BrandonW 
22:53 < BrandonW> Is it read-only?
22:53 < Tari> top pane is the tree, listbox is detail view of the selected certificate field
22:53 <@_Auron_> helped move martin's sister from san antonio to arlington in a day, then helped move martin to his new apartment, and his sister to her new apartment in dallas within 3-4 days a weekend months later
22:53 < Tari> until changing it gets implemented :)
22:54 < kirsk> that is not moving a whole house
22:54 <+Netham45> I'm bored; someone give me something to code.
22:54 < Tari> but that's not too hard, since it's just a matter of inserting a cField_t in the appropriate place
22:54 < BrandonW> Code a certificate editor, Netham.
22:54 < kirsk> i have an app idea
22:54 <@_Auron_> Netham45: Realistic AI
22:54 -!- Tahben [~chatzilla@ip70-162-174-179.ph.ph.cox.net] has joined #tcpa
22:54 < Tari> or, work on mine
22:54 <+sir_lewk> I mean moving a house with tons of jacks and trucks :P
22:54  * Tari creates svn for certutil
22:54 <+Netham45> Tari, what language?
22:55 < Tari> C#
22:55 < BrandonW> Your screenshot's kind of what I had in mind, just a hex editor kinda view in the bottom pane.
22:55 < kirsk> make an app that lets. you select fields/elements on websites and turn it into xml feed updates every set interval
22:55 <@_Auron_> sir_lewk: each time we used a 26' uhaul
22:55 < kirsk> so you can feedyour bank transfers in semi realtime to a desktop panel
22:55 <+sir_lewk> no no, physically move the building
22:56 <+Netham45> Tari, I have minimal C# experience, but I guess I could try to help a bit.
22:56 <+sir_lewk> I want to do that someday
22:56 < BrandonW> You could always go your own way in your language of choice.
22:56 < Tari> check out the code, try to do something with it, meh
22:57 <+Netham45> BrandonW, what, do you just want something that breaks down the cert into fields(selectable VIA the top box), and outputs the HEX value for them in the bottom box?
22:57 < BrandonW> Yes, some of the fields are nested and it's a pain in the ass to modify manually.
22:57 < BrandonW> I'd prefer to be able to double-click it to edit the bytes in it or just do it in the bottom pane, too.
22:57 <+sir_lewk> wow, 15 minutes and still nobody else is done
22:57 < kirsk> wat sirlewk
22:58 < Tahben> I thought you boys were done in 30s
22:58 <+sir_lewk> I have no idea, they're drowning in there for some reason
22:58 < kirsk> wat
22:58 < kirsk> sperm dont drown
22:58 <+sir_lewk> Tahben: hmm?  I'm 20
22:58 < kirsk> i think
22:58 <+Netham45> sir_lewk, perhaps it was one of those tests that goes, "Distregard all instructions, sit here and do nothing. If someone turns in a test, laugh at them."
22:58 <+sir_lewk> hahaha
22:58 < BrandonW> I have no idea if you've looked at the certificate at all, Netham, but each field can be a container for other fields within it. And the parent container has size bytes for everything within it.
22:58 < BrandonW> So it's pretty easy to parse, it's just getting the application to deal with that crap for you.
22:59 <+Netham45> I havn't ever looked at the cert before. All static offsets?
22:59 < BrandonW> Take a look at one of the txt dumps in http://brandonw.net/crap/
22:59 < BrandonW> And follow it by hand.
22:59 <+sir_lewk> it was all like "design an algorithm to find the middle element (sorted) of an unsorted list" and I was all like, "use a modified quicksort to find the nth element, where n is lenght/2"
22:59 -!- Goplat [~goplat@76-191-156-24.dsl.dynamic.sonic.net] has joined #tcpa
22:59 <+sir_lewk> bammo
23:00 -!- mode/#tcpa [+v Goplat] by etaonrish
23:00 < BrandonW> http://brandonw.net/crap/83PlusCertificate.txt First byte is always 00, ignore it.
23:00 <+sir_lewk> not hard at all
23:00 < kirsk> it is raining HARD
23:00 < BrandonW> First field is 0A 15, and the lower nibble defines the size (in this case 5).
23:00 < kirsk> i am all WET
23:00 < BrandonW> So the next 5 bytes are the data for that field.
23:00 <@_Auron_> I WANT RAIN
23:00 <@_Auron_> fuck texas
23:00 < BrandonW> Next field is 0A 2D (a D means the byte following this is the size), so 40 is the size and the next 64d bytes are the data.
23:00 <+sir_lewk> http://brandonw.net/crap/glk.jpg IS THAT REALLY GLK? :O
23:00 -!- Randomist [~winterven@216.117.121.227] has joined #tcpa
23:00 < Tari> http://svn.taricorp.net/certutil/
23:00 < BrandonW> And so on.
23:00 < efneTI92> [Randomist] CAUTION:  Exposure to this user may cause neurological damage.
23:00 < BrandonW> sir_lewk, yes, that's really him.
23:00 -!- Randomis1 [~winterven@216.117.121.227] has joined #tcpa
23:00 < Tari> svn co that if you like, anyone
23:01 <+sir_lewk> glk got busted by the ATF? D:
23:01 <+Netham45> egads, lag.
23:01 <+Netham45> I just got the past 3 minutes of convo at once. =/
23:01 < kirsk> i woop
23:01 < Randomis1> Tari / sir_lewk:  Would either of you know how to get ALSA or OSS to output rear speakers though extertal mic port?
23:01 < kirsk> iWoop
23:02 < Tari> hehe, no
23:02 < BrandonW> The problem here is that you don't know which fields are containers and which aren't. It's typical of TI for the second nibble (x in 00x0h) to be zero if it's a container.
23:02 < kirsk> lolwut
23:02 <+sir_lewk> no, sorry :/
23:02 < BrandonW> So you can hard-code that or actual field IDs if you want.
23:02 <+sir_lewk> I've been pretty lucky with linux sound always working for me, I've never had to really delve into it :/
23:02 <+Netham45> okay, BrandonW.
23:02 < kirsk> outputting through. mic port is not something gthat works outoftheboxes
23:03 <+sir_lewk> but no really, why did glk get arrested by the ATF?
23:03 < kirsk> i think
23:03 < BrandonW> Everything is Big Endian, too (the data for some fields like 0200h is stored Little Endian, but as far as parsing the certificate, it's Big Endian).
23:03 < Randomis1> kirsk:  My hardware can do it, I just need to figure out what to set.  :P
23:03 < kirsk> did he really?
23:03 < kirsk> ah ok sry rand
23:03 <+sir_lewk> if that really is glk, then it looks like it
23:03 <+Netham45> BrandonW, k.
23:03 < BrandonW> sir_lewk, he wasn't really arrested by the ATF, he was in a movie called In The Line of Duty: Ambush at Waco and he was an extra in it, playing a drug fiend being arrested.
23:04 < BrandonW> That's from the movie.
23:04 <+Netham45> waiting for VS08 to load. =/
23:04 <+sir_lewk> aah, nice!
23:04 <+Netham45> first time loading on this user acc't, blah.
23:04 < kirsk> i cant view the pic :( wmirc wont let me select it for copyypastaaa
23:04 < kirsk> haha clool
23:04 -!- kirsk [~krisk@host064-001.kpn-gprs.nl] has quit [bye]
23:04 < BrandonW> I know that's not the best explanation ever, so just ask if you need more.
23:04 -!- glk [glk@adsl-71-153-168-103.dsl.tul2ok.sbcglobal.net] has joined #tcpa
23:05 < BrandonW> I think parsing that file can give you the general idea, though.
23:05 -!- mode/#tcpa [+v glk] by efneTI89
23:05  * Netham45 waves at glk.
23:05 <+Netham45> BrandonW, Okay.
23:05 <+sir_lewk> glk is a movie star :)
23:05 -!- kirsk [~krisk@host064-001.kpn-gprs.nl] has joined #tcpa
23:05 -!- kirsk [~krisk@host064-001.kpn-gprs.nl] has quit [Connection closed]
23:05 <+sir_lewk> oh, I saw Owen Wilson last week, in Philly
23:05 <+Netham45> brb, rebooting. Forgot I have 2 more GB of RAM to add to this PC.
23:05 < BrandonW> I've never seen the OS or boot code hard-code the logic that 00x0h is a container field, but I've never seen that rule violated.
23:05 < BrandonW> So I think we can run with it.
23:05 <+sir_lewk> it was kind of underwhelming actually
23:06 -!- Netham45 [~YouJustGo@c-67-166-1-212.hsd1.co.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: Z:8015-190D]
23:07 < BrandonW> That's not 100% true, there is one funky thing in an 8XQ file.
23:07 < BrandonW> Which I don't really get.
23:07 < BrandonW> But who knows.
23:07 -!- dpunkt [~dpunkt@p5090C438.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Quit: Nettalk6 - www.ntalk.de]
23:07 < Tahben> is glk the data weirdo?
23:08 < BrandonW> Yes.
23:08 < Tari> with much DATA in MATH, yes
23:08 < Tari> (bwaaagh, laggy)
23:08 < BrandonW> 01 01 33 is in one of my 8XQ files, I have no idea what that is (I think it might be the revision number). But anyway, 0101h has a zero and 33h is obviously not a field, so who knows.
23:09 < BrandonW> There's also 00 10 which has no data right before it.
23:10  * sir_lewk glares at the CS sys-admin and disables compositing
23:10 < BrandonW> Everything after that's pretty standard.
23:10 < BrandonW> I think some of the fields actually always have signatures (02 0D 40) attached to them, too.
23:10 < BrandonW> I really have no idea, that's the purpose of writing it. :)
23:13 -!- Randomis1 [~winterven@216.117.121.227] has quit [Client Quit]
23:13 < BrandonW> The lack of documentation on this is disturbing.
23:13 < BrandonW> Still no idea what fields 0600h/0800h do.
23:13 -!- Randomis1 [~winterven@216.117.121.227] has joined #tcpa
23:13 < BrandonW> And they're probably super important.
23:13 < BrandonW> I'm pretty sure you put keys in them.
23:13 -!- Randomis1 [~winterven@216.117.121.227] has quit [Client Quit]
23:18 -!- HelDragon [~jd@modemcable178.248-201-24.mc.videotron.ca] has joined #tcpa
23:21 -!- Randomist [~winterven@216.117.121.227] has quit [Quit: leaving]
23:22 <@_Auron_> wow, toasted the bread a bit too long
23:23 <@_Auron_> they're like giant brown crackers
23:23 <@_Auron_> still good though, just super crunchy
23:23 < Tahben> CRACKERS
23:25 < Tahben> I'd punch a dolphin for a whole grain cracker right now
23:25 < leofox> -whole grain -er
23:25 <@_Auron_> lol leo
23:26 < leofox> lol crack
23:26 < Tahben> I learned I can't eat wheat thins anymore.
23:27 < Tahben> what word do you guys prefer (choose only one): teat or breast, referring to a human female.
23:28 < leofox> wut
23:29 <@_Auron_> referring to a female or part of a female?
23:29 < leofox> sounds like you're talking about the mammaries of the human female
23:29 <@_Auron_> I'm assming the latter
23:31 <+krisk> leofoxxxxxxx
23:31 < leofox> kiiiiirsk
23:31 < Tahben> yeah. the tits
23:31 < Tahben> teat or breast.
23:32 < leofox> ive never heard the word teat in my life
23:32 < leofox> are we talking about your tits or tits in general?
23:32 <+krisk> not enough farming tv shows/series
23:35 < Tahben> I'm just shocked at seeing the word "teat" in regard to the specified anatomy in a book about such anatomy. I realize milk bags is a little colloquialistic, but still.
23:41 -!- Zombine [Zombine@c-67-166-1-212.hsd1.co.comcast.net] has joined #tcpa
23:42 < Tahben> http://www.dadlabs.com/The-Lab/breast-pump-dad.html
23:43 < Zombine> Anyone know why my PC won't boot with 6GB of RAM(2x1, 2x2 sticks), yet it'll boot with any combo of all 3 sticks? My PSU isn't even getting near it's limit, and all of the sticks have tested perfectly good.
23:43 < Zombine> (I'm Netham45, btw.)
23:43 <+krisk> theres your problem
23:43 < Zombine> My guess is because hardware hates me, but I want something better than that. =/
23:43 <+krisk> define "wont boot"
23:44 < Tahben> dude, I'm hardcore. I'll have you strip everything to start.
23:44 < Zombine> doesn't boot. I turn it on, it sits there for ~10 seconds, then just starts beeping at me.
23:44 <+krisk> does your mb support 6gb?
23:45 < Tahben> oooh
23:45 < Tahben> continuous beeping? mobo? bios?
23:45 < Tahben> I TOLD U I WUZ HARDCORE
23:45 < Zombine> kriskyes.
23:45 < Zombine> krisk yes. *
23:46 < Zombine> 8GB max(4x2GB)
23:46 < Zombine> I've cleared the BIOS and ensured that no auto-overclocking or anything is taking place.
23:48 < Tahben> does it beep continously if you pull out everything including RAM?
23:48 < Zombine> Tahben, yes.
23:48 < Tahben> what if you pull the cpu.
23:48 < Zombine> ...
23:48 < Zombine> that step seems a bit overly-drastic.
23:49 < Tahben> Like I said
23:49 < Tahben> it shouldn't beep at all if the cpu is pulled
23:49 < Tahben> well, depends on the design
23:49 < Zombine> I'm not pulling the CPU, there's nothing wrong with it.
23:51 < Tahben> did you try 1 stick of ram in the first slot, then each sucessive one?
23:51 < Zombine> Tahben, yes. It booted in all configurations I could try, except with all 4 sticks in.
23:51 < Tahben> ahhh
23:51 < Tahben> so it works flawlessly with one stick
23:52 < Zombine> yes, all 4 sticks work in all 4 slots by themselves.
23:52 < i_c-Y> did you look at the beep patterns in the manual?
23:53 < Tahben> or RAM specs in the manual
23:53 < Zombine> i_c-Y, it's a continious beep, which the manual describes as 'general RAM failure'
23:53 < i_c-Y> which motherboard is this?
23:53 < Zombine> Asus P5N-E SLI, based off of the nVidia nForce 650i chipset.
23:53 < i_c-Y> you can also try a bios update if available.
23:54 -!- jujaga [~jujaga@S010600223f954e49.gv.shawcable.net] has joined #tcpa
23:55 < i_c-Y> i think that you may have to up the RAM voltage beforehand then stick in all 4 sticks or something
23:56 < i_c-Y> its just a problematic board.
23:56 < jujaga> hai guys
23:57 < Zombine> i_c-Y, k. What voltage should I try?
23:57 < Zombine> no idea what it is stock.
23:57 < i_c-Y> Zombine: first try the latest bios 
23:57 < _Digital> what does is say on the sticker of teh ram?
23:57 < Zombine> It's on the latest as-is.
23:57 < _Digital> it should vary betwen 1.8 and 2.1
23:58 < Tari> jdec says 1.8V for ddr2
23:58 < _Digital> some run as high as 2.1 or 2.2 though :\
23:58 < Tari> well, apparently I forgot what that organization is, that's not jdec
23:59 < Tari> yeah, but the spec says 1.8
23:59 < i_c-Y> could go a bit up, also may have to drop the clocks - the P5N-E is a bad board with a bad chipset - i wouldnt put it past if it cant run 8 gigs except of 1 brand
23:59 -!- mode/#tcpa [+v jujaga] by efneTI86
23:59 < Tari> ah, it's jedec
23:59 < Tari> I had the sound of it right
--- Log closed Sat Sep 05 00:00:05 2009